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| Gothic 2, could this be the one? |
| Yes! Sure it is! |
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88% |
[ 16 ] |
| Bah, i rather play tetris. |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| It's tie with MW. |
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11% |
[ 2 ] |
| Dunno, my mom said that i'm only allowed to play Disney games. |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
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| Total Votes : 18 |
Daedalus
High Emperor
Joined: 04 Jan 2002
Posts: 2516
Location: Estonia |
hmm donno i seen NWN by my friend and i didnt like it too much cos there was too much reading i prefere more voice acting  |
Sun Oct 06, 2002 11:33 am |
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Danicek
The Old One
Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 5922
Location: Czech Republic |
I am not sure about this, but I think that G2 will have most + that MW had and it will be little bit more limited and linear and this will be good - at least for me :]. |
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Sun Oct 06, 2002 3:29 pm |
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Gorath
Mostly Harmless
Joined: 03 Sep 2001
Posts: 6327
Location: NRW, Germany |
Guys, I think some of you are expecting too much. All German mags say the gameplay makes an excellent impression, <i>but the graphics, although improved, are still worse than Morrowind´s</i>.
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Webmaster GothicDot |
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Sun Oct 06, 2002 5:16 pm |
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RobKob
Head Merchant
Joined: 20 Aug 2002
Posts: 73
Location: Thuringia, Germany |
quote:
Originally posted by Gorath
Guys, I think some of you are expecting too much. All German mags say the gameplay makes an excellent impression, <i>but the graphics, although improved, are still worse than Morrowind´s</i>.
Hmm, I think this is a matter of personal opinion, taste and preferences. I for one like even G1's graphics better than MW's.  Sure, G1 looks more geometrical, angular and the stairs are ramps. It's all ... cruder. OTOH MW looks very organic and stylish and has nice water effects.  BUT it's slower and the world is divided into countless tiny parcels and so are the dungeons. The interior of houses and dungeons is seperated from the outside. Every hundred meters you have a small but noticeable loading pause. The viewing distance is very limited. The world is ... odd. Mostly it's miles and miles of little hills. Even the fertile regions have a rather sparse vegetation and there are no forests. All caves - even those that are underwater - have a nice wooden door.  The raindrops are like neutrinos, they can pass unhindered through any matter blocking their path to the ground.  The NPCs are zombies and the fauna is dumb  and only attacks you. Well, G1 hasn't any of these disadvantages or flaws ( although admittedly G1's four biggest dungeons ARE seperate worlds ). And I like G1's weather and sky better, esp. the night sky with the moon and shooting stars. 
So, therefore I like G1's graphics better, but I was referring to graohics in a broader sense. I was also considering performance, "worldscape", realism etc.   
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"Time to toss the dice." Matrim Cauthon |
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Sun Oct 06, 2002 6:48 pm |
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SlamDunk
Village Leader
Joined: 26 Dec 2001
Posts: 86
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Gothic 2 does not even have to be a Morrowind killer 'cos Gothic 1 already was one, and G1 was released way before MW.
Morrowind left me cold. Gothic made me feel funky |
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Sun Oct 06, 2002 7:06 pm |
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Remus
Overgrown Cat
Joined: 03 Jul 2002
Posts: 1657
Location: Fish bowl |
quote:
Originally posted by RobKob
... I for one like even G1's graphics better than MW's...... but I was referring to graohics in a broader sense...
So you mean (indirectly) in "narrow sense" (one to one/specific comparison) G1's graphic NOT better than MW's graphic? 
From what my eyes have seen, if we crank up MW's graphic capabilities up to it maximum, and compare it to G1's graphic (also in maximum setting) - MW surely will looking better than G1. However the comparison is not that fair since G1 released around six earlier than MW, not to mention i bet Bethesda poured a lot of money in graphic department to make it looks fabulous. I think this is almost a fact (that MW has groundbreaking graphic); if not, why many reviewers, almost all of them said the MW's graphic is excellent. So i won't say the graphic issue is just about personal taste/opinion/preference, unless strangely you insist on to look at this thing together with other factors like performance, "worldscape", realism, etc.
As for G2's graphic, maybe it still not on par with MW, but that by not means G2 won't be a good game. Graphic is not everything in CRPGs. Some games use 2D graphic and still can have excellent gameplay, and this is a well known fact.
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Sun Oct 06, 2002 8:59 pm |
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TheCleric
Fearless Paladin
Joined: 11 Jan 2002
Posts: 230
Location: Upstate NY, USA |
| To throw in my 2 cents.. (long) |
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I played Gothic and loved it. I played Morrowind and loved it too. I'm drooling, waiting for the English version of Gothic ll.
Both games have elements that I think set them apart. What I'd love to see would be a game that blended the best elements from both.
Gothic ll's graphics will probably not be as good as Morrowind's, but I can live with that. I though Gothic's graphics were OK and since they have improved on them, I'm sure they'll be more than acceptable. Although Morrowind's music was good, I actually liked Gothic's better. The NPC's in Gothic were much more interactive and believable than those in Morrowind. Also, I very much prefer the voice acting from Gothic to the readable dialogue boxes in Morrowind. I also appreciated the fact that you could lay down and sleep in Gothic and the unlimited amount of things you could carry. And, although there were fewer women in Gothic, they sure looked a lot better than those in Morrowind.
On the other side of the coin, I loved the huge landmass and the sheer number of quests in Morrowind. It had many more towns, villages and places to visit than Gothic did. Also, although Morrowind's Character Creation process was a little too complicated, I liked being able to pick the starting variables for my character's skills, attributes and appearance. I also liked Morrowind's system for raising skills. The more you used a skill/weapon, the better you got in it (you want to be good at Magic, use it a lot, you want to be good with a sword, use it a lot). And the fact that you had access to improve ALL possible skills (even ones you hadn't picked as major's or minor's). I also liked the ability to mix-n-match various armors and to use a shield to block attacks.
I think the idea to have only one ending for Gothic ll (with multiple paths to get there) is a good one. I'd love to see breakable doors and objects. One thing I think both games were lacking in, is in-game cutscenes. I'd like to see a few more. "Crusaders of Might and Magic" was a game that had a nice Armor/Weapons handling interface that you seldom hear of. It didn't do well in sales (at least partially because it was too short), but it did have some nice features. I'd love to see a system like that implemented in Gothic. I also preferred the ability to buy and use just about any armor/weapon/spell in Morrowind. Gothic's combat system was definately better than Morrowind's and I hope they don't change it too much for Gothic ll.
I liked the "Romance Quests" poriton of Morrowind. It was nice to let the Player NPC have a romantic interest, not to mention a place to come back to where you could store your stuff, relax and figure out what you were going to do next. I liked the "Stronghold" idea, but wish the player had a little more influence on the appearance and contents of it. I would also have been nice to have been able to move your "Romantic" interest into your Stronghold once you got it. Maybe someday a game will come out that combines all these great features. I'm sure that it will be a smash hit if it does.
One thing that I hope games like Morrowind and Gothic l, Gothic ll accomplish, is to show the gaming industry the popuarity of 1st/3rd person Action/RPG games, where the player conrtolls just 1 character. For years, I've watched RPG games come out that sounded cool, only to be disappointed at discovering that they had the familiar top-down perspective (which I can't stand). Hence, I was limited to playing FPS games in order to have the 1st person perspective that I enjoy. It's nice to see games coming out offer a 1st person perspective, but bring in RPG elements. I for one, hope this trend continues.
Anyway, this long post sums up my thoughts on the Morrowind vs Gothic debate. |
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Sun Oct 06, 2002 10:42 pm |
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hoyp
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Oct 2002
Posts: 501
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quote:
Originally posted by Khalsa
G1 I bought solely because of this website. Other game sites that eventually reviewed it talked about all the negatives and then seemed surprised that the game was still fun. I thought G1 was revolutionary but once they created that level of realism, I wanted more - don't let me just steal from everybody, etc.
MW blew me away when I first got it, but I agree with the previous post that essentially it was a lifeless world. Bethesda does not understand how to make non-cardboard cutout NPC's - it felt like I was talking to a computer script every time. Also, monsters charging blindly with no AI other than that seems worse in a first person game than a top down game for some reason.
NWN is AMAZING. There are actually some very good SP mods built by the user community (some lasting as long as a retail game), but the heart of it is multiplayer. I have had my top gaming experiences ever playing through a DM made module with a party - truly amazing.
G2 I expect will set the bar for the single player experience, as long as they enhance the level of response the NPC's have to your actions. The alive world is the secret of Gothic.
i couldnt agree more
although nwn's singleplayer sucks |
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Sun Oct 06, 2002 11:05 pm |
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RobKob
Head Merchant
Joined: 20 Aug 2002
Posts: 73
Location: Thuringia, Germany |
@goofy goldfish
O.K. I'll try to put it another way.
I did indeed indirectly say that MW's graphics "in a narrow sense" look better than G1's. If you have two screenshots, one from MW and one from G1, than the one from MW is bound to look better in almost all cases. But when I play I don't care about screenshots. I think graphical quality does not only depend on the number of polygons that can be displayed or on special effects. It depends on the world that is created with the engine and the performance. What good is a superb graphic engine if your game world is a featureless plane? Or if it needs so many resources that the world has to be cut in hundreds of minute pieces which means constant loading and a minimal viewing distance? Well, MW does have nice art and architecture, but Vvardenfell is quite monotone and unrealistic. It's really just miles and miles of small hills with different textures in the different areas. If you know one region of Vvardenfell you basically know them all. A nicer looking graphic increase your immersion into the game world, but this is more than negated in MW due to the constant loading of cells, the fact that each small shack is a small world by itself, only via teleporter connected to the outside world. And I was definitely not satisfied with the viewing distance in MW. So that are the reasons why I just cannot concentrate on just the "narrow sense " of graphic. However, I realize that I was steering off the way when including NPC and fauna behavior into the broader sense of graphic.  But it does include motions, getures, mimics and poses of NPCs and /or monsters, and MW is disappointing in this department too.
All in all I like G1's graphics better than MW's, but MW's other qualities make it still a slightly better game than G1 in my book. However, I am absolutely sure that G2 will be much better than MW. 
_________________
"Time to toss the dice." Matrim Cauthon |
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Mon Oct 07, 2002 12:22 am |
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Xelis
High Emperor
Joined: 24 Jul 2002
Posts: 523
Location: Seattle, Washington |
Well said RobKob! 
I, too, own MW. And I have the exact same feeling.
_________________
"Don't you call me a mindless philosipher, you old weight lob of grease."
~C-3PO Human/Cyborg Relations |
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Mon Oct 07, 2002 2:42 am |
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Shrapnel
Rocket Scientist
Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 1325
Location: Newark, NJ |
quote:
Originally posted by Khalsa
The alive world is the secret of Gothic.
Exactly right. The NPCs actually seem to have personalities, and the way they all wake up, eat lunch go into their huts @ night...not to mention some of their actions (pissing in corners, smoking weed, checking their half-empty bottles, washing their faces).
Sometimes its not all about the graphics, its about the way a game can pull you in and make you feel immersed into the world created |
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Mon Oct 07, 2002 6:08 pm |
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RobKob
Head Merchant
Joined: 20 Aug 2002
Posts: 73
Location: Thuringia, Germany |
I just remembered one thing that I really, REALLY liked about MW, perhaps most of all: the LORE.
I simply loved to visit libraries and bookstores and read about the world of Tamriel, it's provinces, peoples, history, celebrities, religions and gods, philosophy, politics and so on. I especially liked the historical stories like "The Real Baranziah" or "2920: The Last Year of the First Era" and also the purely fictional ones. I spend entire days reading.
There is a big difference between the somewhat boring and unrealistic gameworld of MW and the rich, intriguing, unique and realsitic TES universe. Simply put, I adore it. I like the lore discussions on the official TES forums and to philosophise myself about how it all fits together, the creation of Nirn, the true nature of aedra and daedra, the disappearance of the dwarves etc.
In Gothic it's the other way around. A rich, intriguing, unique and realistic gameworld but little lore and boring books. In G2, I hope that we will learn a lot more about Myrtana and the rest of the world and that the books will be more entertaining and will have more than merely two pages each ( but ONLY if they ARE more entertaining - otherwise it would be a turture  ).
OK, considering all the other virtues of G2 it's probably not a high priority, but it definitely would be nice, wouldn't it? 
And thanx for your support, Xelis. 
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"Time to toss the dice." Matrim Cauthon |
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Fri Oct 11, 2002 10:32 am |
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Jaz
Late Night Spook
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 9708
Location: RPGDot |
The Real Barenziah series in MW is censored though. Had to check that after reading the 'original' in Daggerfall .
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Jaz |
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Fri Oct 11, 2002 2:17 pm |
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Shrapnel
Rocket Scientist
Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 1325
Location: Newark, NJ |
Lore is good up to a sense. If its part of an ongoing series (M&M series, Baldur's Gate, Ultima, etc etc) then it makes sense to create chapters and chapters of lore because you get attached to the series after playing 2 or more installments of it. Thats when you've mastered the gameplay mechanics and now you are more interested in the background of the land and the plot chars. Too much lore in the 1st installment of a series can make it boring real fast or can make you forget about bothering to read books altogether.
Ex: Summoner. (OMG I think I read more in that game than in freshman year English 101 at college) For the 1st installment of the series all that text is really not worth reading because you havent grown attached to the game yet, more likely you are just looking for the more powerful armor and weapons. |
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Fri Oct 11, 2002 3:52 pm |
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Remus
Overgrown Cat
Joined: 03 Jul 2002
Posts: 1657
Location: Fish bowl |
quote:
Originally posted by Jaz
The Real Barenziah series in MW is censored though. Had to check that after reading the 'original' in Daggerfall .
Actually there is mods available to make the censored version back to orginal/uncensored version. I already read it, nothing special, but it does make even a tough policeman blushes & shaking his head...
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Fri Oct 11, 2002 6:38 pm |
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