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elkston
High Emperor
Joined: 21 Sep 2002
Posts: 691
Location: North Carolina, USA |
| Translation of Games from their Native Language |
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With many recent CRPGs (and hybrids) being developed in Russia / Germany / Europe the issue of good translations has been on my mind.
I was playing a demo of the originally German game, "Zanzarah: The Hidden Portal". In it, I found many cases where the text was grammatically correct, but did not seem "natural". The word choices and sentence structures just seemed awkward -- like nothing a native English speaker would come up with.
I also caught a screen shot from the upcoming action/RPG game STALKER (which looks awesome). In it, there were bits of a conversation and the English was really bad. Again, "correct", but just so wacky and obviously translated. Now granted, that game is not even released so I am hoping that the dialogue gets a full review to fix those issues.
What appears to be happening in these cases is that the translations are being done by people/groups that are competent in translating to English, but are not "Native Speakers". By not being immersed in English all their lives, they don't realize what colloquialisms or phrasings "work" for us. The translations therefore end up being quite sterile.
I think that a good translation requires two stages:
1. A native speaker in the *original* language who is also fluent in the target language does the translation. In this way, most of the nuances from the mother tongue are picked up and a -decent- attempt is made to transfer them to the traget language
2. A native speaker of the target language then proofreads all the text in the translation and fixes any portions that don't work or sound "translated". 
It seems to me that the games which fail to have good translations don't have step 2. They either don't have the budget or resources to go through a second "beta" phase where native speakers of the target language get to critique the translation.
It does seem possible to have a quality translation that seems natural. Gothic 1 & 2 (though 2 had a few iffy moments), and Arx Fatalis are both very, very good. So good that you wouldn't realize they were originally done in other languages. My guess is that since both these games have full voice acting, the voice talent was able point out any quirks in the original translations they found. It is also possible that they also had the budget and resources to get really good translations and feedback from native speakers before the product shipped.
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All shall hear the words of Karras...the words of Karras |
Wed Oct 29, 2003 9:29 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
"All your base belong to us." 
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Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound=  |
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Wed Oct 29, 2003 9:34 pm |
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stanthony
One Smart Dog
Joined: 28 Oct 2002
Posts: 556
Location: Tallinn, Estonia |
Ahhhh... Translation issues...
I see translation problems every day. About 1/3 of my games are Russian versions of English/German/etc games. Not that I prefer translation over English, but Russian licensed games are just several times cheaper here. So... I often want to save money.
Well, to be honest most of the games I have are well translated. I understand what ammount of work people put into translating such PRGs as, say, Morrowind. And I'm simply grateful they did it. But sometimes I wonder why? how? who could do such terrible unspeakable texts? I think the main problems are time and/or low funds. Publishers may have their schedule and there are often about 2-3 months or less to release Russian version of English game.
My favorite example is from Wizardry 8. I never saw English version, but I'm pretty sure it says something different. When your scout will see some creature, but cannot yet identify it, he/she will say (in Russian): "A creature in camouflage is scouted!" In Russian it sounds *very* stupid 
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- Druids do not fight with metal weapons! Sit here, and you over here. Put the elbows of your right arms on the table...
- Arm-pulling? Get me back me pan!
R.A.Salvatore The Cleric Quintet. Canticle |
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Wed Oct 29, 2003 9:53 pm |
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elkston
High Emperor
Joined: 21 Sep 2002
Posts: 691
Location: North Carolina, USA |
Correction:
The screenshot with the bad translation I saw was from "Xenus", not "STALKER". Here is a link to the shot:
http://cgi.actionvault.ign.com/display/display.cgi?http://actionvault.ign.com/features/media/xenus/xenus080604.jpg
Now any native English speaker can look at that and immediately know how it could be done better.
Here is the text:
"Ha-ha-ha! You're quite a humourous guy! Of course, this is not an institution for noble ladies. You've got the best weapons store in the western part of this God forgotten country."
Now this is how *I* would say it:
"Hmpf. You're a funny guy. You sure you're in the right place? This is a weapons shop -- best one in this God-forsaken country if you ask me. Not exactly the place for a clean-cut hombre like yourself."
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All shall hear the words of Karras...the words of Karras |
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Wed Oct 29, 2003 9:59 pm |
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MageofFire
Griller of Molerats
Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 1594
Location: Monastery of Innos |
Now, granted, I don't know a lot about Xenus, but from the screenshot you showed it looks like it takes place in Mexico. While I think that's no excuse not to translate it effectively into English, Mexicans are generally not native speakers of English, so I think the English should sound as if a Mexican were speaking English, if you get my drift. I think they did a pretty good job there.
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OMG! WTF?! MONKEYS!!!!
=Member of numerous usergroups=
=Active in none of them=
Mediocreties, I absolve you! |
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Wed Oct 29, 2003 11:25 pm |
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Northchild
Fearless Paladin
Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 232
Location: New York, USA |
As a funny aside, one of the things that originally attracted me to console-style RPGs was the poor translation. I'm able to read and write U.S. English at a fairly high level, and games that don't "read" like the local newspaper or the latest pop. novel appeal to me in a way that games with more exacting translations don't. The U.S. release of Revelations: Persona was one of my favorite games - the sense of mystery was very real to me. At the time I had to endure a difficult family and living situation... so the quirky personality of Persona became an ideal escape for me. In turn, my interpretation of poetry, fiction, and art from Japan has influenced my own creations since I was very young.
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New to 3D? Check out www.3dbuzz.com today! |
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Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:05 am |
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elkston
High Emperor
Joined: 21 Sep 2002
Posts: 691
Location: North Carolina, USA |
quote:
Originally posted by MageofFire
Now, granted, I don't know a lot about Xenus, but from the screenshot you showed it looks like it takes place in Mexico. While I think that's no excuse not to translate it effectively into English, Mexicans are generally not native speakers of English, so I think the English should sound as if a Mexican were speaking English, if you get my drift. I think they did a pretty good job there.
Yeah, but "Institution for noble ladies"???? C'mon....
_________________
All shall hear the words of Karras...the words of Karras |
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Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:16 am |
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MageofFire
Griller of Molerats
Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 1594
Location: Monastery of Innos |
It's actually pretty funny if you think about it. Hey, we all have slips of the tongue. 
_________________
OMG! WTF?! MONKEYS!!!!
=Member of numerous usergroups=
=Active in none of them=
Mediocreties, I absolve you! |
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Thu Oct 30, 2003 1:00 am |
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Jaz
Late Night Spook
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 9708
Location: RPGDot |
Just like stanthony said, we Euros have to fight with bad translations quite often - and if the translations are okay, voice acting is crappy. It's a rule . And it's why you'll rather buy originals instead of translations. So being sufficiently fluent in a few languages certainly comes in handy.
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Jaz |
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Thu Oct 30, 2003 5:59 am |
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~NOBODY~
The One And Only
Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Posts: 1824
Location: Vivec, Jobasha's Rare Books |
quote:
Originally posted by elkston
Yeah, but "Institution for noble ladies"???? C'mon....
In Russian it sounds pretty well. It's even used in old literature.
@Jaz: I usually see bad translation & good voice. Because translation is done by programs and then only corrected by people, but voice is usually people's work.
@Stan:Is it "Sushestvo v camuflage"  ? If yes, it's completely crazy!.. |
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Fri Oct 31, 2003 11:21 am |
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stanthony
One Smart Dog
Joined: 28 Oct 2002
Posts: 556
Location: Tallinn, Estonia |
quote:
Originally posted by ~NOBODY~
In Russian it sounds pretty well. It's even used in old literature.
But this is exactly the problem of translating, one must not simply translate the text, all the cultural specifics should be taken into account. If there was no such thing as "Institut blagorodnyh devits" in the West, then translator should use another term. Something similar that would ring a bell for English speakers.
quote:
Originally posted by ~NOBODY~
@Stan:Is it "Sushestvo v camuflage" ? If yes, it's completely crazy!..
Yes it is! Can you imagine how mad I was after spotting my 300th susshestvo v kamufljazhe!?!
_________________
- Druids do not fight with metal weapons! Sit here, and you over here. Put the elbows of your right arms on the table...
- Arm-pulling? Get me back me pan!
R.A.Salvatore The Cleric Quintet. Canticle |
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Fri Oct 31, 2003 1:45 pm |
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~NOBODY~
The One And Only
Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Posts: 1824
Location: Vivec, Jobasha's Rare Books |
Yeah, it's usually like that! But sometimes it's translated quite good, even better sometimes. Like Arx, I die from laughing when Goblins tell each other jokes.
About "Susshestvo v kamuflage": I don't think a normal russian person could say this, even accidentally. But looks like it was either translated by a person who talks russian slightly, or by a program. The second is the right IMO.
But it sometimes is fun... |
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Fri Oct 31, 2003 4:57 pm |
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Gorath
Mostly Harmless
Joined: 03 Sep 2001
Posts: 6327
Location: NRW, Germany |
quote:
Originally posted by Val
"All your base belong to us."
Almost. Itīs "All your base are belong to us." The other brilliant example is "Somebody set up us the bomb."
http://www.kiplange.com/cortex6.html
Scroll down. Football players should consider themselves warned. This Bundesliga photo is really brutal.
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Webmaster GothicDot |
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Sat Nov 01, 2003 10:06 am |
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elkston
High Emperor
Joined: 21 Sep 2002
Posts: 691
Location: North Carolina, USA |
quote:
Originally posted by Val
"All your base belong to us."
Where is this quote from? 
_________________
All shall hear the words of Karras...the words of Karras |
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Sat Nov 01, 2003 2:59 pm |
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Korplem
Swashbuckler
Joined: 23 Dec 2002
Posts: 853
Location: Pearl Harbor, HI |
http://www.planettribes.com/allyourbase/AYB2.swf
_________________
If soot stains your tunic, dye it black. This is vengeance.
-The Prince of Nothing |
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Sun Nov 02, 2003 3:37 am |
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