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Neo_Genesis
The Assassin
Joined: 10 Aug 2003
Posts: 3050
Location: The Netherlands |
| Powell now doubts Iraq evidence |
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quote:
Secretary of State Colin Powell conceded Friday evidence he presented to the United Nations that two trailers in Iraq were used for weapons of mass destruction may have been wrong.
In an airborne news conference on the way home from NATO talks in Brussels, Belgium, Powell said he had been given solid information about the trailers that he told the Security Council in February 2003 were designed for making biological weapons.
But now, Powell said, “it appears not to be the case that it was that solid.”
He said he hoped the intelligence commission appointed by President Bush to investigate prewar intelligence on Iraq “will look into these matters to see whether or not the intelligence agency had a basis for the confidence that they placed in the intelligence at that time.”
Powell’s dramatic case to the Security Council that Iraq had secret arsenals of weapons of mass destruction failed to persuade the council to directly back the U.S.-led war that deposed the Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein. But it helped mobilize sentiment among the American people for going to war.
As it turned out, U.N. inspectors were unable to uncover the weapons, but administration officials have insisted they still might be uncovered.
David Kay, who led the hunt for the weapons, showed off a pair of trailers for news cameras last summer and argued that the two metal flatbeds were designed for making biological weapons.
But faced with mounting challenges to that theory, Kay conceded in October he could have been wrong. He said he did not know whether Iraq ever had a mobile weapons program.
Powell told reporters that as he worked on the Bush administration’s case against Iraq U.S. intelligence “indicated to me” that the intelligence was solid.
“I’m not the intelligence community, but I probed and I made sure, as I said in my presentation, these are multi-sourced” allegations, Powell said.
The trailers were the most dramatic claims, “and I made sure that it was multi-sourced,” he said.
“Now, if the sources fell apart we need to find out how we’ve gotten ourselves in that position,” he said.
“I have discussions with the CIA about it,” Powell said, without providing further details.
The trailers were the only discovery the administration had cited as evidence of an illicit Iraqi weapons program.
In six months of searches, no biological, chemical or nuclear weapons were found to bolster the administration’s central case for going to war: to disarm Saddam of suspected weapons of mass destruction.
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Always wondering how it would be... |
Sat Apr 03, 2004 7:10 pm |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
Good thing the mass graves that WERE found mean nothing, eh? It's rather revealing that people will condemn US actions based on the sanctity of life while ignoring the mass graves. Either Iraqi lives don't count, or they're blind hypocrites. Which one do you think it is?
_________________
=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Sat Apr 03, 2004 9:47 pm |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
Hypocrites. Its not like Suddam only had 2 hours notice to get anything he didn't want the invading forces to find out of the country (or buried in the sand like E.T. for the atari). He had months (and I believe help from France, Germany, and Russia, but of course no way to prove it or any facts at all to back it up. Thats just what I think).
I wish Bush had more charisma and wit. When Sheraq kissed his wife's hand, Bush should of kissed Sharaq's hand in turn. And then called him Ma'am. That would make good TV also.
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Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Sat Apr 03, 2004 10:00 pm |
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Hexy
High Emperor
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 621
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Awwww, I thought SOME people would try to spinn this off on another book? Too bad.
quote:
Good thing the mass graves that WERE found mean nothing, eh? It's rather revealing that people will condemn US actions based on the sanctity of life while ignoring the mass graves. Either Iraqi lives don't count, or they're blind hypocrites. Which one do you think it is?
Huh? People who condemn the groundless US invasion and occupation of a sovreign nation support mass graves? I don't quite see what this has to do with anything. Oh... wait. It's that isolationistic either-you're-with-us-or-against-us-cowboy-mentality?
quote:
Hypocrites. Its not like Suddam only had 2 hours notice to get anything he didn't want the invading forces to find out of the country (or buried in the sand like E.T. for the atari). He had months (and I believe help from France, Germany, and Russia, but of course no way to prove it or any facts at all to back it up. Thats just what I think).
Hmmm... yeah, all those WMDs the US (Bush Administration version 1.0) sold him some 15 years ago can't just have disapeared, can they? Who's the hypocrite?
And, yeah, I'm sure 'Freedom' and Germany helped him hide WMDs simply to try making the US look bad, something that the Bushes can do perfectly well without any help.
EDIT: Post numbah 500. Finally, after about 21 months.
_________________
Like some bold seer in a trance;
Seeing all his own mischance |
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Sat Apr 03, 2004 10:19 pm |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
quote:
Originally posted by Hexy
quote:
Good thing the mass graves that WERE found mean nothing, eh? It's rather revealing that people will condemn US actions based on the sanctity of life while ignoring the mass graves. Either Iraqi lives don't count, or they're blind hypocrites. Which one do you think it is?
Huh? People who condemn the groundless US invasion and occupation of a sovreign nation support mass graves? I don't quite see what this has to do with anything. Oh... wait. It's that isolationistic either-you're-with-us-or-against-us-cowboy-mentality?
I added the bold type just so there was no confusion.
To state that the "invasion" was groundless means that there's nothing wrong in Iraq, yes? Poor Saddam was an innocent victim of the Bush family vendetta. Either there was a reason to remove him from power (that would be the genocide evidenced by the mass graves, folks) or there wasn't, which means that the thousands and thousands of dead Iraqis in those mass graves don't count. Which one would you choose- there's a valid reason, or dead Iraqis don't count?
_________________
=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Sat Apr 03, 2004 10:38 pm |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
I choose "dead Iraqis don't count." The Iraqis have all the right to kill themselves they want, and Saddam, by being the nations Soverign and divine rulerhe can kill whoever he wants. Unlike Molosovick who was an upstart and white so he shouldn't kill the people living in Serbia or Croatia without NATO intervention, plus Clinton was president then and he was better looking than bush so of course his decisions were sounder. The invasion of Irag was baseless and sensless and shamefull. I'm going to go urinate on the US flag. Be back in two seconds.
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Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Sat Apr 03, 2004 11:37 pm |
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cptmaxon
High Emperor
Joined: 19 Jun 2003
Posts: 557
Location: Israel |
| Re: Powell now doubts Iraq evidence |
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quote:
Powell told reporters that as he worked on the Bush administration’s case against Iraq U.S. intelligence “indicated to me” that the intelligence was solid.
the u.s intelligence services said that the intelligence was solid at the time powell had not liad to the Security Council he just said what he though was right as for groundless invasion iraq was run by a madman sadam already used chemical weapons in the 80s against the cordes and there was no reason to think he will not do it again not to mention the fact that he was a cruel dictator which killed in his own people so as far as i'm concerned the us did good
_________________
"We're still flying"
"it's not much"
"It's enough" |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 12:12 am |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
No we didn't. We intruded into the legal affairs of another country with out the backing of France and Germany and Russia. We are evil. What Saddam did to his own people doesn't matter. The percieved threat to other countries doesn't matter. We did not have permission from France, Germany, or Russia and Saddam is the divine ruler of his country and can do as he pleases. I am ashamed to be an American at this dark hour. Molosovick was totally different. Tell them Hexy. Talk some sense into these murder hungry savages.
_________________
Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 12:18 am |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
Always the source of interesting facts to take the misinformed down a peg... Now, Sammy, if you can find similar quotes from John "Flip-Flop" Kerry, I shall really be impressed. 
_________________
=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:48 am |
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Hexy
High Emperor
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 621
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quote:
To state that the "invasion" was groundless means that there's nothing wrong in Iraq, yes? Poor Saddam was an innocent victim of the Bush family vendetta. Either there was a reason to remove him from power (that would be the genocide evidenced by the mass graves, folks) or there wasn't, which means that the thousands and thousands of dead Iraqis in those mass graves don't count. Which one would you choose- there's a valid reason, or dead Iraqis don't count?
Oh, you mean like the US military killing thousands of Iraqi cilivilians because of their groundless reasons? That Iraqis are being killed today? The US brings pseudo-democracy and calls it liberation. Haha.
Well, why didn't the US say it was because they simply wanted to help Iraqis from the start? Was it because they knew that reason wouldn't hold any water, or was it because they simply didn't know they were completely clueless on the WMD issue, even though everything spoke against them? What's worse?
It's nice to try and spinn things off on Clinton, but he was after Bush 1. You've seen one imperialist, you've seen them all indeed.
quote:
The percieved threat to other countries doesn't matter. We did not have permission from France, Germany, or Russia and Saddam is the divine ruler of his country and can do as he pleases. I am ashamed to be an American at this dark hour. Molosovick was totally different. Tell them Hexy. Talk some sense into these murder hungry savages.
The percieved threat, lol. How come the US was the only one to see this enemy as dangerous? Because a bully picks on the weak? But it's nice to know that you want the US to start invading other countries simply because of the "evil" leaders. Really. They Bushes are paladins! Look at how much peace and stability the US has brought!
...
Man, you sure proved me wrong.
_________________
Like some bold seer in a trance;
Seeing all his own mischance |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 6:32 am |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
Hexy, why attack me? I sided with you. You never answered the Molosovick question either.
_________________
Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 7:18 am |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
quote:
Originally posted by Hexy
quote:
To state that the "invasion" was groundless means that there's nothing wrong in Iraq, yes? Poor Saddam was an innocent victim of the Bush family vendetta. Either there was a reason to remove him from power (that would be the genocide evidenced by the mass graves, folks) or there wasn't, which means that the thousands and thousands of dead Iraqis in those mass graves don't count. Which one would you choose- there's a valid reason, or dead Iraqis don't count?
Oh, you mean like the US military killing thousands of Iraqi cilivilians because of their groundless reasons? That Iraqis are being killed today? The US brings pseudo-democracy and calls it liberation. Haha.
Well, why didn't the US say it was because they simply wanted to help Iraqis from the start? Was it because they knew that reason wouldn't hold any water, or was it because they simply didn't know they were completely clueless on the WMD issue, even though everything spoke against them? What's worse?
I'd like to see your "indisputable evidence" about the thousands of Iraqi civilian casualties. It's only fair if you're going to demand "indisputable evidence" on the WMD thing. Now, since you've seen fit to avoid the question I asked the first time, I'll try a slightly different version. How do you condemn the 1000's of Iraqis dead at the hands of US troops (I'll just assume your proof is on its way) and yet you have no desire to protect the 10000's (or more) Iraqis dead at the hands of Saddam? The only difference I can see is whom you are naming as the killers. Evidently, genocide is OK, as long as it's your own countrymen, eh?
_________________
=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 7:32 am |
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Hexy
High Emperor
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 621
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quote:
I'd like to see your "indisputable evidence" about the thousands of Iraqi civilian casualties. It's only fair if you're going to demand "indisputable evidence" on the WMD thing. Now, since you've seen fit to avoid the question I asked the first time, I'll try a slightly different version. How do you condemn the 1000's of Iraqis dead at the hands of US troops (I'll just assume your proof is on its way) and yet you have no desire to protect the 10000's (or more) Iraqis dead at the hands of Saddam? The only difference I can see is whom you are naming as the killers. Evidently, genocide is OK, as long as it's your own countrymen, eh?
http://www.iraqbodycount.net/
Does this suffice or do you want me to go through CNN articles since the war started? Although I don't demand idesputible evidence of WMDs. I demand SOME kind of evidence with even a shred of credibility.
As for condemning one and igonring the other. It's more like this: 2 wrongs don't have to make a right, specially in this case. Bush lying his way into war, ignoring international laws and protests, just to put Iraq into the battlezone it is now (with a complete disregard of Iraqi culture and structure) isn't completely justified by removing one bad guy from power. Are Iraqis that much happier under the US? Is that why they hang dead americans off a bridge?
quote:
Hexy, why attack me? I sided with you. You never answered the Molosovick question either.
Ummm... that's wasn't sarcasm? So hard to not misunderstand someone over the internet. You really are ashamed of not being given permission by France and Germany? Then I suppose you never really asked a question about something unrelated like Molosovick?
_________________
Like some bold seer in a trance;
Seeing all his own mischance |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 8:21 am |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
To borrow a tactic from "your side" of the debate, your information is clearly partisan propaganda with no basis in fact. I'm curious how they get from 692 named (which I'm sure is subject to debate in itself) to 8-10k.
The fact that you would condone the recent atrocity against US civilians with such glee shows your true colors as far as I'm concerned. You've dodged any questions you don't feel like dealing with, and then cite animalistic barbarism as a sign of "your side's" righteousness. Time for me to move on before I puke.
_________________
=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:12 pm |
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