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Seth
Last Man Standing
Joined: 23 Jan 2002
Posts: 1008
Location: Faerun |
Everybody is entitled to own opinions, remember “for one man junk, for another gold”. Statements like “THIS GAME SUCKS” only means YOU didn’t liked (and few thousand others  ), but still doesn’t make it bad, because there is another few thousand who loved it. So we can argue until both of as turn blue and we still won’t any closer to resolve our differences, I think everyone should respect each other individuality.
For the record Fallout is my all time game and I love turn based combat. Recent games like “Silent Storm” or “Etherlords” have little to none RPG elements and yet I enjoy playing them.
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Money - An article which may be used as a universal passport to everywhere except heaven, and as a universal provider of everything except happiness. |
Thu Apr 01, 2004 1:21 pm |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
Seth, do I have do misspell rediculous again? Do I?
Obviosly my opinion is worth more than others because I am right.
People are entittled to their own opinions, but if they do not coincide with mine then they are wrong. God has granted me with a special ability called "omnirightness" and told me I will always be right from henceforth. And as Corwin's signature says, "If God said it, then that settles it." You really need to stop thinking in such bland terms such as what you like, and start thinking about what I like.
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Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Thu Apr 01, 2004 4:40 pm |
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konny666
Noble Knight
Joined: 03 Jul 2003
Posts: 219
Location: Babylon 6 |
Lintra,
You can get Dragon Wars here, from Home of the Underdogs:
http://www.the-underdogs.org/game.php?id=336
It came out in 1990. I doubt you would have gotten it confused with X-COM. |
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Thu Apr 01, 2004 7:16 pm |
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Lintra
Elf Friend
Joined: 23 Apr 2002
Posts: 9448
Location: Bermuda, the triangle place with SANDY BEACHES |
quote:
Originally posted by konny666
Lintra,
You can get Dragon Wars here, from Home of the Underdogs:
http://www.the-underdogs.org/game.php?id=336
It came out in 1990. I doubt you would have gotten it confused with X-COM.
Thanks Konny. I *think* it was X-com since I got DragonWars out of the bargain bin at KB Toys for something like 6.99 or 5.99. Believe it or not, I have gotten it downloaded and guess what? It runs! No need to resort to DosBox. Wow.
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=Member of The Nonflamers' Guild=
=Just plain clueless= |
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Thu Apr 01, 2004 7:28 pm |
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EverythingXen
Arch-villain
Joined: 01 Feb 2002
Posts: 4342
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Hope it comes with the journal book.
Might have to download it myself... no idea where the disks could be after 14 years and 6 moves. 
Roqua has a few good points, of course... combat in Infinity Engine is crap. That's part of the reason I didn't like the first Icewind Dale that much. Cut the story, more with the crap. BG2 and Torment are the two IE games I like most... and it's for story, not combat.
And the combat in NWN is the exact same. It's what I dislike most about the game, though I've long since become accustomed to that sort of click frantically swing wildly combat so I'll never dock a game with a pause feature for combat. NWN has cool animations to break up the monotony of 30 goblins at least.
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Estuans interius, Ira vehementi
"The old world dies and with it the old ways. We will rebuild it as it should be, MUST be... Immortal!"
=Member of the Nonflamers Guild=
=Worshipper of the Written Word= |
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Fri Apr 02, 2004 5:20 pm |
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Arma
Mysterious Lady
Joined: 24 Oct 2003
Posts: 1230
Location: in the middle of hell |
Well, IE battles really were not that good, but they were definately better than NWN. NWN is one of those games, that I asked myself several thousand times -> Why the heck am I playing this?, never found a real answer, and I stiil finished it (the Original, not the expansions, still wondering whether to get to them). |
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Thu Apr 08, 2004 5:14 pm |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
Seth, just in case you thought I was serious in my last post I was joking. I don't know how obvious it was or not. What you said is right and said well. I like to joke around, and I wasn't sure you knew or not. Anyway, if you read between the the lines in my idiotic posts there is usually something worth reading sometimes, if for nothing else just for entertainment purposes.
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Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Thu Apr 08, 2004 5:25 pm |
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Lintra
Elf Friend
Joined: 23 Apr 2002
Posts: 9448
Location: Bermuda, the triangle place with SANDY BEACHES |
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Armageddona
Well, IE battles really were not that good, but they were definately better than NWN. NWN is one of those games, that I asked myself several thousand times -> Why the heck am I playing this?, never found a real answer, and I stiil finished it (the Original, not the expansions, still wondering whether to get to them).
I never finished the OC either. It just got to the point where I didn't feel like playing it. However! I very much enjoyed the Hordes expansion, and some of the mods have been really good.
But if you are not into it ... then save your money and buy something you are into. Personally I've gotten sucked in by FreeLancer and my sanity is now being threatened by X2: The Threat. But these are (most likely) not for you either ... but I could be wrong!
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=Member of The Nonflamers' Guild=
=Just plain clueless= |
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Thu Apr 08, 2004 9:50 pm |
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Schattenherz
Head Merchant
Joined: 21 Sep 2003
Posts: 71
Location: Nuremberg, Old Europe |
NWN-OC was horrible. I couldn't finish it, because I was bored to Death. What redeemed NWN for me is the Community. Some of the Player-created Mods are just awesome. The Shadowlords/Dreamcatcher Series are the true Heirs of Baldur's Gate for me, and Elegia Eternum is outstandig.I also liked the CC-Serie and Tragedy of Tragidor. If you can stand Disc-World like Fantasy-Humor, the Penultima/Penultima rerolled Series are great too (well except Part one, it has some funny Moments but is gameplay-wise bad Hack & Slash).
AFAIK you don't need the Expansions for nearly all of them (IRC only the later parts of CC and Eelgia Eternum are needing the XPs).
The Expansions are better than the OC but are story-wise still inferior to BG (not that there is a lot of Competition out there at the moment ...) 
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"Insanity in individuals is something rare - but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule."
-Nietzsche |
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Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:48 pm |
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konny666
Noble Knight
Joined: 03 Jul 2003
Posts: 219
Location: Babylon 6 |
Schattenherz, I'm with you on NWN. It's all about the community. The first OC was really bad, I'd only think of playing it again if I spent a significant amount of time in the toolset changing things. The 2 expansions were good, but still not "excellent": SoU was 'good' compared to most user-made mods; and comparing HoTU to user-made mods... *visually* it blows them all away, and there are some interesting aspects of the story. But still, combat is ridiculously easy, munchkinism is rampant, blahblahblah.
I am replaying the old IE games now. I started with IWD2, but now I'm back on BG2. For IWD2, I actually *liked* the combat, I think it has the best implementation of the Infinity Engine, especially as far as combat is concerned. BG2 combat OTOH, is a real headache. And its not the fact that I'm unfamiliar with high-level 2ed. gaming, I just find many of the combats to be genuinely annoying unless I use "cheese".
And let me tell you, the IE engine is just FULL of cheese. The NWN engine might have cheese, but its very easy to account for almost all of them using scripting, which I've done in the past.
But generally speaking, for a party-oriented CRPG where you control all the characters... turn-based combats are of essence. My very first CRPG from 1988 ("The Eternal Dagger") has the most complex/realistic combats of any CRPG I've seen since then (more complex than ToEE I believe).
A cool game that featured turn-based and "CRPG-like" tactical combat was "UFO" also known as "X-Com". The *first* game in that series rocked. If they made games like that again, I'd eat them up.
As for party-oriented vs. single-character RPG's. I think single-character RPGs are more in line with the spirit of role-playing, especially when you play them multiplayer. Party-oriented tactical stuff is still great, and has its place, but I would put them closer to the "wargaming/strategy" shelf. Nothing wrong with that, considering my favorite game of all time is still Sid Meier's Civilization...
Aside: give yourself a cookie if you actually read all of my blathering post... |
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Fri Apr 09, 2004 4:13 am |
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Dhruin
Stranger In A Strange Land
Joined: 20 May 2002
Posts: 1825
Location: Sydney, Australia |
Chocolate-chip?  Yes, party-management is a step in the strategy direction but a lot of CRPGs lack any real roleplaying and party tactics in combat add some needed depth to those games. If enough games had the genuine character depth of (for example) Fallout, I would prefer a single character.
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Editor @ RPGDot |
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Fri Apr 09, 2004 5:04 am |
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konny666
Noble Knight
Joined: 03 Jul 2003
Posts: 219
Location: Babylon 6 |
chocolate *chips* are so 80's. I prefer choco *chunks* instead. you know, when there's more CHOCOLATE than COOKIE? guaranteed to make you see your dentist 3 months early. 
i don't think i prefer one or the other (single char or party-based). for the longest time I resisted single character RPGs. for example, in the early 90's when all the British gaming magazines were harping on about "Ultima Underworld" I just couldn't get into it. Instead I preferred Origin's traditional Ultima titles. Later, when the commercial Internet entered the mainstream and the Diablo craze began, I didn't go anywhere near it and haven't to this day. only recently, I think, have single-character RPGs attained a semblance of role-playing as opposed to roll-playing. that's why i'm not as apprehensive to the genre.
will party-based games have a comeback? i'm not sure. i'm guessing that sales of ToEE have been dismal(1). doesn't matter if the game was a quality one or not. maybe the europeans can fill the void... but I always find something missing about one of their games. they seem to echo something about the culture they're from, which is fine, but also makes them seem "foreign" or unfamiliar. and they appear to be evolving, so they may end up like how japanese "RPGs" are today - not my cup of tea.
(1) since Atari has failed to give it the appropriate amount of support |
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Fri Apr 09, 2004 8:41 am |
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Seth
Last Man Standing
Joined: 23 Jan 2002
Posts: 1008
Location: Faerun |
@ Roqua
No harm done, I was just a little upset, because I though I was the only one giventh this "omnirightness" ability. So I wanted straighten this up with some legal proceedings; however they don’t have lawyers over there. 
_________________
Money - An article which may be used as a universal passport to everywhere except heaven, and as a universal provider of everything except happiness. |
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Fri Apr 09, 2004 1:15 pm |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
Seth, It is up there, not over there. Ha, once again I am right and have proven that I am the only one with the gift of "omnirightness".
Konny666, I have never heard of "The Eternal Dagger." Does it play at all on windows xp?
Have you ever played the Realms of Arkania Trilogy or Darklands?
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Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Sun Apr 11, 2004 5:03 pm |
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Lintra
Elf Friend
Joined: 23 Apr 2002
Posts: 9448
Location: Bermuda, the triangle place with SANDY BEACHES |
quote:
Originally posted by konny666
...
A cool game that featured turn-based and "CRPG-like" tactical combat was "UFO" also known as "X-Com". The *first* game in that series rocked. If they made games like that again, I'd eat them up.
...
Agreed! I loved that game.
Could you define 'cheese'? I've never tried BG2 and so the reference to cheese goes right over my head (sorry, but I'm still stuck in the 70's for slang *grin*)
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=Member of The Nonflamers' Guild=
=Just plain clueless= |
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Mon Apr 12, 2004 12:16 pm |
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