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| who do you typically side with |
| conservatives (republicans, right wingers) |
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47% |
[ 8 ] |
| liberals (democrats, left wingers) |
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29% |
[ 5 ] |
| neither |
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23% |
[ 4 ] |
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| Total Votes : 17 |
txiabxyooj
Fox Spirit
Joined: 06 Dec 2001
Posts: 971
Location: here, there & everywhere |
@XSamhainX, thanks for sharing your story with us. you present a powerful arguement for the republican party & right-wingers in general.
_________________
"The origin of things, if things have an origin, cannot be revealed to me, if revealed at all, until I have travelled very far from it, and many revolutions of the sun must precede my first dawn. The light as it appears hides the candle." --Santayana
=member of the worshippers of the written word=
=member of the Non-flamers' guild= |
Fri Sep 20, 2002 7:52 pm |
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-Rattlesnake-
Guards Lieutenant
Joined: 24 Mar 2002
Posts: 165
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I hate political labels.
I'm hardcore isolationist and socialist. I think the government should have little to no say in our personal lives. However, I also believe that late-term abortions are murder (she can't do it during the first 6 months,) any man(or woman) who wants to should be able to buy any gun he wants, cigarettes are taxed way to heavily, modern civil rights leaders and feminists are idiots, we shouldn’t subsidized business, work in management and Clinton should never have been President. Does that make me a "leftist" or a "rightist?" Neither.
Both political parties in this country are full of morons, and have almost identical platforms. I used to be a member of the democratic socialist party, now I'm a Green. I know I'll never see a country even close to what I want, but Greens might gain power in my lifetime.
quote:
But I started to really see thru alot of the environmental-type and Big Biz conspiracy fallacies I used to thrive on. I found that those people are the new communists. The more i looked objectively at their arguments, and what they wanted to accomplish, and who they hated, I realized that "environmentalism" and anti-Big Biz was merely a smokescreen for anti-capitalism.
So basically you traded in your "big-biz" conspiracy theories for communist conspiracy theories?
Honestly, I found your whole post hilarious. I'm pretty sure you made the whole thing up, because you seem to have the mentaility of someone who has never met a liberal in there life. Sorry, anyone who makes statements like "all liberals hate the rich and are lazy commies" or "all conservatives are just idiots who've been brainwashed by Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity" has never gotten to know anyone who thought different than them.
I'm pretty sure you joined the military at 18 and formed your opinions there. Because I've never met anyone who actually knew a liberal who claimed stuff like you're claiming. Although I do know pleanty of people who speand all thier time hating liberals say it.
_________________
Wake this one unto the stinging lash
Every man rise from the ash
Each betrayal begins with trust
Every man returns to dust
-Phish, Farmhouse
Last edited by -Rattlesnake- on Fri Sep 20, 2002 10:57 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Fri Sep 20, 2002 8:58 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
@Sammy: 
Although, I don't always vote Republican. Take the last gubernatorial race in Utah. I didn't vote for Leavitt. That guy is an idiot who has never met a tax increase that he didn't like. One of the few things I like about him is his hard-core stance on nuclear waste being stored in Utah, which is: Heck no. I voted for his Democrat opponent, Orton.
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound=  |
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Fri Sep 20, 2002 9:32 pm |
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ButtOfMalmsey
Village Idiot
Joined: 07 May 2002
Posts: 785
Location: Mississippi |
quote:
Originally posted by -Rattlesnake-
I'm hardcore isolationist and socialist. I think the government should have little to no say in our personal lives.
How do you square sentence 2 with socialism? Just curious.
_________________
"It has been a grand journey- well-worth making once."
-Winston Churchill, 1965, on Life
I saw this in a movie about a bus that had to SPEED around a city, keeping its SPEED over fifty, and if its SPEED dropped, it would explode. I think it was called, "The Bus That Couldn't Slow Down."
-Homer Simpson
=Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Member of The Sixth House=
::Captain of the Black Company::
Last edited by ButtOfMalmsey on Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:05 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:04 pm |
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-Rattlesnake-
Guards Lieutenant
Joined: 24 Mar 2002
Posts: 165
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quote:
All liberals are lazy sh*thead commies who should be shot. Now stop flaming.
-Val |
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Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:04 pm |
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-Rattlesnake-
Guards Lieutenant
Joined: 24 Mar 2002
Posts: 165
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Butt:
Socialism doesn't have to affect your personal life. In fact, there are many socialist countries in Europe where it doesn't. Granted, you don't get to spend all your money on everything you want, because it's used to help others, inb the form of nationalized health care (something the US will probably adopt withing 10-20 years,) free colledge/school and welfare/welfare-to-work programs.
However, that doesn't mean you have to say what jobs people have and what substances they can use. Socialist countries, while they have higher economic restrictions, have less personal restrictions.
_________________
Wake this one unto the stinging lash
Every man rise from the ash
Each betrayal begins with trust
Every man returns to dust
-Phish, Farmhouse |
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Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:12 pm |
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ButtOfMalmsey
Village Idiot
Joined: 07 May 2002
Posts: 785
Location: Mississippi |
quote:
Originally posted by -Rattlesnake-
Butt:
Socialism doesn't have to affect your personal life. In fact, there are many socialist countries in Europe where it doesn't. Granted, you don't get to spend all your money on everything you want, because it's used to help others, inb the form of nationalized health care (something the US will probably adopt withing 10-20 years,) free colledge/school and welfare/welfare-to-work programs.
However, that doesn't mean you have to say what jobs people have and what substances they can use. Socialist countries, while they have higher economic restrictions, have less personal restrictions.
Okay, so your position is that economic freedoms are not equal to civil liberties. Just curious.
_________________
"It has been a grand journey- well-worth making once."
-Winston Churchill, 1965, on Life
I saw this in a movie about a bus that had to SPEED around a city, keeping its SPEED over fifty, and if its SPEED dropped, it would explode. I think it was called, "The Bus That Couldn't Slow Down."
-Homer Simpson
=Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Member of The Sixth House=
::Captain of the Black Company:: |
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Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:27 pm |
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-Rattlesnake-
Guards Lieutenant
Joined: 24 Mar 2002
Posts: 165
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I guess so. I'm sure some peopel consider economic freedoms to be civil liberties, but I don't.
_________________
Wake this one unto the stinging lash
Every man rise from the ash
Each betrayal begins with trust
Every man returns to dust
-Phish, Farmhouse |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 2:19 am |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
quote:
Originally posted by -Rattlesnake-
quote:
All liberals are lazy sh*thead commies who should be shot. Now stop flaming.
-Val
What the-?! 
@Rattlesnake: What is that?
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound= |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 5:37 am |
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Provis
High Emperor
Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 872
Location: Middle of the Forest |
@Val
I'm just guessing, but don't you love guns and have alot of them, or weren't you really anti-gun control in that thread atleast? 
For rattlesnake's sake I hope it's what he meant.  
_________________
--
"Yea, so what I didn't like Planescape: Torment, what are you gonna do about it?" - Provis |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:13 am |
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xSamhainx
Paws of Doom
Joined: 11 Sep 2002
Posts: 2192
Location: San Diego |
Thats where you are wrong, Rattler. Economic freedom is a primary civil liberty and what gives one the ability to have a higher standard of life, and enjoy other civil liberties and freedoms. Gives someone a reason to want to progress, wheres the inspiration to ever achieve anything if the law prohibits it or confiscates it? Thats a quality life?I consider that oppression. Talk to someone whos flat-broke about how much freedom they feel they have. That is exactly the kind of thing that keeps a country as a whole in a state of stagnation. Look at my lifes example from earlier. When I wasnt making squat in that horrid machine shop, I was very limited in what I could do personally as far as accomodations and transportation, recreation, even social life.The ability to make more money, to progress is what drove me to to the success I enjoy now. And why shouldnt I? It pumps more taxes into the economy too, for you tax fiends, doesnt it? Economic freedom gives people a reason why to aspire to more, to want to do better. To "have a life". To enjoy their freedoms, and success. People that are stuck in a financial rut basically get up, go to work, eat, and sleep because thats all they can afford. That is, if they arent drawing a check from the state.... Still, even then they are broke! Like most of you short-sighted so-avowed "socialists", you would rather than give everyone the opportunities to raise their standard of living higher, bring every one down to the lowest common denominator instead. No way, Im for equal opportunity to achieve, not the equal spreading of misery, which is your doctrine. I crack up when people talk about the "free" healthcare and the like in these socialist gardens of eden they fantasize about. Sorry, it aint *free* by any stretch of the word, for people who get half their earnings confiscated to fund it. Except for those who dont work I guess, they are loving it.What if i dont use the doctor for a year? I still pay for it, and thats BS. And another thing, the quality of these *free* things are terrible at best. People are literally dying at times because they arent able to see a doctor in time.
-"Currently, even the most liberal Canadian politicians label their national health care system a failure, screaming for complete overhaul, and even suggesting *market-based solutions*."<-note to Rattler, see that?
"Canada calls its program a "one-tier" health care system, which sounds good, except the reality is that everybody gets virtually no health care, but on an even basis." <- Thats your shangri-la in action. Canada is in the middle of a health care crisis over your ideas. They are moving towards privitization, or trying to, while democrats and people like you want to move towards their failure.
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2001/9/10/55739.shtml
-"It takes nearly 25 weeks to get an appointment with an ophthalmologist in Canada, almost 21 weeks to receive orthopedic care, more than 18 weeks to get a heart by-pass, over 16 weeks to see a neurosurgeon, and nearly 12 weeks for a gynecological exam." <- Thats 3 MONTHS wait for a woman to basically go get a pap smear. What about things like breast cancer that have to be caught fast, and taken care of in a flash? You can die in the time it takes you to see a Dr, or move to the surgery stage.
http://www.ncpa.org/ea/eajf93/eajf93r.html
Lookee here, things are the same in the France, once called the "Best Healthcare System in the World", undoubtably because its "free for all", now on the brink of collapse. I wont even mention Britain.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/2150103.stm
In summation, when anything is funded like you see it, like the way you supposedly want it, it fails. Why? Because if anything is *free*, people are going to flock to it whether they need it or not. It also opens up the door wide-open to abuse and fraud when the govt is paying the bill. It also gives the doctors no reason to do any better, because they never can really progress or make any more than they are rationed. Alot of times, they are TOLD what branch of medicine they will practice, for petes sake. Id hate to be the poor guy who's told he needs to study to be a Proctologist. This goes full-circle back to the way economic freedom ties into personal freedom, and success of person and nation. Look at these health care professionals in these places. They are no doubt miserable, working under said conditions, understaffed and underpaid, and no way things are ever gonna get better only worse.No room for progress. And in return they most likely start not giving a rats arse [hehe] about the very people who are on the recieving end of their *free*care. Look at the people, probably waiting a month for a venereal disease test.Thats why people are coming across the border and paying for services here, because the only way to really get quality care is thru the private sector, your big govt solutions are failure. If BIg all encompassing mommy-GOvt was the way to go, USSR would have been heaven on earth. It was a police state, and it imploded. I know Im talking about communism here, but thats the next step up from where youre at and where these "socialists" are at.
Last edited by xSamhainx on Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:55 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:15 am |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
quote:
Originally posted by Provis
@Val
I'm just guessing, but don't you love guns and have alot of them, or weren't you really anti-gun control in that thread atleast?
For rattlesnake's sake I hope it's what he meant.
I have no idea what Rattlesnake means by that post unless it's supposed to be a very poor joke, in which case I'm not laughing. I also never said anything like what that post implies. So again, what is the meaning of that post Rattlesnake?
I never said I was anti-gun control. I do believe in enforcing the current gun control laws we have. They are at least reasonable. I only own two guns. I have a 30.06 (that's a rifle) and .357 (that's a pistol) for hunting. Anything more than that would be redundant.
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound= |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:50 am |
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xSamhainx
Paws of Doom
Joined: 11 Sep 2002
Posts: 2192
Location: San Diego |
And another thing, the "Greens" are NEVER going to win anything. But, please, keep effectively throwing out your vote. Keep being a "loser".JUst like the "Losertarians" as Ive heard them called before. They are called that because they dont win anything. They arent going to win anything, they are going to LOSE. Id rather have you throwing your vote away to the Greens then adding strength some wild-card Democrat candidate who promises you free health care, tho. If a 3x5 plot of marijuana in your backyard is your definition of freedom, you quite frankly are in the minority and put the real freedoms that matter in this country to shame. |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:53 am |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
@Sammy: I told you to stop the name-calling. Second warning.
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound= |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 7:04 am |
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-Rattlesnake-
Guards Lieutenant
Joined: 24 Mar 2002
Posts: 165
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Val, I was talking about this
@Sammy: 
I assume you were giving him a "thumbs up" for his "liberals are all lazy potheads who do nothing for society post" post.
Sam, are you somehow trying to troll me? I have to say you're probably the worst troll I've ever seen. Your insults are incredibly sophormoric and your arguements transparent. You seem obsessed with maintaining the status quo and base your opinions on what the "majority" thinks, not what you consider right or wrong.
You also made a few basic fallacies:
First off, my opinion cannot be "wrong," seeing as morals, opinions and viewpoints are all subjective. Also, you don't seem to understand socialism at all, you seem to think it's some sort of Communist dictatorship. And it should be noted that for the money we speand on healthcare in the US, we could set up a natonalized healthcare system.
And also, as much as you may scream at me that the world will never change, the sun revolves around the earth and 2+2=5, you're not going to make it true. |
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Sat Sep 21, 2002 5:21 pm |
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