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xSamhainx
Paws of Doom
Joined: 11 Sep 2002
Posts: 2192
Location: San Diego |
This thread is truly hilarious! First, a guy who “loves his education more than anything” cant stay in school, cant conform long enough to get a diploma, and its all because we went to war in Iraq. =] He figured out in the 5th grade, mind you, that "it seemed like all the school looked for was funding, and all I became was a test score to them." What 5th grader is thinking about school funding and such?? He writes well alright, Elkston. I think this "well written" expose here is actually nice copy and paste job, quite frankly ='.'=
You guys are being taken for a ride! 
Seriously! Give that whole first post a good read again. See what I mean? Then look at the responses he gives, it all ultimately comes out to his political spiel.
quote:
"Finally high school came and with it a new president. A new program called No Child Left Behind was introduced and I thought that finally someone cares. A new school was built in the “urban” part of town. The district paid 50 million dollars on a giant school packed with computers for every student, and the most qualified teachers the state could afford."
Oh come on, what teenager is banging this out on his keyboard? Then cmk and a few others offer some sympathy and possible help. No, he's too far gone. He's doomed already. The first true victim of the M.O.A.B....
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My best hope is finding a good school system or alternative. Anyone know of any? If nothing else I'll find a country that cares more about educating its future citizens than building bombs to drop on everyone else. How's Canada this time of the year?
Yeah, the school of Drama Queens in New York. Youd fit in just fine!
You people are being drawn in by a "Seminar Poster"!
I can just see him glancing over his shoulder, "ill get by.. somehow..."
Then, a sincere and truly concerned Ammon comes and gives the guy some advice, sympathy, etc. I know Ammon has had problems, and I believe the guy is sincere.But Aram doesnt seem to really care about that. "Thanks but no thanks, im too far gone already" I can almost hear him say in my head. "Lets talk about how the Bush administration ruined my education because we went and fought the Taliban." It's so patently obvious!
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it really says something about your country when you spend more on military than anything else. We wouldn't need so much military spending if they just spent some extra time teaching us how to treat the world. The problem begins when we offend so many other countries through ignorance
Then he just goes on and on thru the typical anti-industrial, anti-this anti-that, anti-american rant. Of course, he gets a few more bites on that, easy subject in this climate. In fact, half his paragraphs look copy/pasted..
Then Llama pipes in and tries to say "huh?" Oh boy, bad move...
_________________
“Then away out in the woods I heard that kind of a sound that a ghost makes when it wants to tell about something that's on its mind and can't make itself understood, and so can't rest easy in its grave, and has to go about that way every night grieving.”-Mark Twain |
Sat Mar 13, 2004 8:54 am |
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xSamhainx
Paws of Doom
Joined: 11 Sep 2002
Posts: 2192
Location: San Diego |
toby, is that you?
quote:
You cant blame or criticize the people doing this, because they are simply a product of your society. If you want this to end, focus your attention on the source of these things, not the outcome
Aram, whose society? I thought you were a disgruntled American?
Come on Roach, I would expect at least you to be savvy enough to see thru this. You, like everyone else that has been sincere, want to talk about an issue you care about. An issue that's looking like a good Left Hook to the face of people who are actually concerned. Looking like it's the last thing he wants to talk about.
_________________
“Then away out in the woods I heard that kind of a sound that a ghost makes when it wants to tell about something that's on its mind and can't make itself understood, and so can't rest easy in its grave, and has to go about that way every night grieving.”-Mark Twain |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:53 am |
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Roach
SBR Belfry Bat
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 3233
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*note, this accidentally turned into more of a rant then a real argument.
@Samhain Well thank you, I think. *sudden flashback to you vs. me vs. moondragon back when you first came to this forum*
This thread has taken an ugly turn towards political cheap shots, but I disagree with you that that was the intend from the first post. Granted the first cheap shot(s) was taken in the first post, I took it as a frustrated ‘lashing out’ and dismissed it.
quote:
Originally posted by xSamhainx
He figured out in the 5th grade, mind you, that "it seemed like all the school looked for was funding, and all I became was a test score to them." What 5th grader is thinking about school funding and such??
Hey, I figured it out in 7th grade, each school‘s person funding is heavily based on attendance. Granted there’s a big difference between 10/11 years old and 12/13, but I don‘t see it as the out of the realm of possibility.
(muttering to myself) *Why am I defending someone else’s post in a debate? I told myself I was going to stop doing that.*
Anyway, I’m going to attempt to turn this back to the No Child Left Behind Act since that’s a personal issue to me. You should know I’m no Bush Basher, I’ve backed him in past arguments that we’ve both been involved in. I personally have sort of a love/hate view of him and most of biggest problems with what he’s done as President come from times when he followed the suggestions of others, i.e. Tenet, Ashcroft, *cough* Rumsfeld, but when it comes to education this ones firmly on him. We all have our weaknesses and I think that one of his is that he’s an optimistic fool when it comes to the topic of education. I mentioned before I was part of the Texas school system, so while I was out of school before the NCLB Act was passed I still had a firsthand view of it because it’s modeled after the same system he set up in Texas as Governor *counts on fingers* twelve years ago. Which coincidentally was when I was in 5th grade. The Texas school system is set up to teach people how the pass the TAAS test, which is the basis of the testing for the NCLB Act. The Texas school system is set up attempt to teach every student the minimum that they need to know to attend collage. Which I will agree with Aram, leaves all it’s graduates in a position to be qualified for only the most basic of jobs if they choose not to, or are unable to, attend collage. And I personally was so burnt out on the concept of formal education by then that for years after quitting school I wouldn’t so much as set foot on a collage campus.
I’m not meaning to imply that Bush screwed up the public school system, rather, I think the NCLB Act is a step in the right direction. However, a very very small step in the right direction. Bush’s educational system, like those of its predecessors, punishes advanced students by trying to teach all students to prepare for a collage system that many can't afford to attend.
There was a creative writing class in my middle school that was run by a single teacher, during what was supposed to be his conference period/period off, that was only open to a few eighth graders due to the fact that there was no funding for anymore than one class. This teacher was considered by the entire school staff to be the best teacher that the school had, and this class, which I was fortunate enough to attend its first year of existence, taught me more and had more of an effect on me as a person than any other class I ever took. In fact I consider that class, and its teacher, to be one of the most positive factors in making me who I am today. Alas, after only three years this teacher was told that he could no longer run his class because the school board wanted him to teach one more TAAS prepatory (sp?) class. This teacher, who was widely known as the best teacher in the school - if not the entire ISD - threatened to quit if they wouldn’t let him have his creative writing class... he now owns and manages a corner book store.
On a personal note, I haven’t seen you around here in a while Sam, glad to see back; I've always liked habit of linking to articles in your signate, and I almost aalways read them. |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:41 pm |
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Aram
Village Dweller
Joined: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 23
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First off, thanks to everyone for the advice. Learning from other people's experiences can prevent your own mistakes.
@Roqua I'm not exactly sure about your advice, but it did make me laugh, which you can never get enough of. 
@Samhain I really have no idea how to respond to that.............thanks?
And back to education, is there any way that it can be improved? If your forced to go through so many years of it, you might as well get something more out of it. The teenage social life isn't exactly exhilarating to me.
Before someone brings this up, yes education does rely on the person being taught. Although you may think that putting more money into the school system wont make someone care any more, it can find new ways to interest them in it. |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 7:34 pm |
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Llama
High Emperor
Joined: 11 Oct 2001
Posts: 509
Location: Earth |
quote:
Originally posted by Ammon777
Whats with all the hostility, Llama?
If you think I'm being hostile, then you seriously need to get out into the real world more often.
quote:
Seems Llama missed a good opportunity to remain silent.
Really? Thanks for adding absolutely NOTHING to the discussion at hand. Perhaps you missed your golden opportunity to remain silent. Go back to your book of nerdish internet statements and get another one.
Aram:
I don't think I'm jumping "way past the mark".
Perhaps it's my lack of education that I cannot read your mind only the words you type. Statements such as "that military spending I mentioned was PAYING for Saddam to torture those innocent people". Conspiracy is just an agreement to perform illegals acts, which would be torture, and since we apparently "paid" him to do so...
We do as any world power should do. Help the helpless. If you think the United States does not attempt to prevent future problems, then you are the byproduct of brainwashing. I'm not sure which psycho has been sitting by your bedside every night telling you stories about what this country does and stands for, but they are sadly mistaken.
Sadly, you obviously say one thing and mean another. It's just rather disturbing when you have kids running around firing off at the mouth about how the world is horrible. How people decades before should have looked into their crystal balls and forseen the trouble in the world. If you think this world can just smile and be happy, then the curtin is still pulled over your eyes.
Sure, we could, as a country pull all our military forces from countries all over the world, and let those areas start back with their civil wars. Sure we could close our borders and ignore calls for help from countries being attacked. Smiles and handshakes will only work with people that don't want to fight in the first place.
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I don’t know why, I just believe a brain can accomplish more than a gun.
I don't know why you think that either. 
_________________
tired of people's shit |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 7:56 pm |
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Aram
Village Dweller
Joined: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 23
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That's all well and good Llama, we simply have different views. The topic is education though.
I just thought of one more thing to add and then I'm done with the foreign policies discussion. If the gun is more powerful than the brain, then remember it was the brain that invented the gun. If you want to look at it as pure domination over everyone, remember that the super powers are always the leaders in technology. If a higher education lead to anything, it would lead to an increase in the sciences, the same sciences that invent the weapons you love so much. Think of the things you can accomplish along those lines, new sources of energy, and new sources of weaponry. A good example of this is antimatter, a new energy source that it currently being researched. A ball of antimatter the size of a BB can power New York City for a day, and has the destructive power of the bomb dropped on Hiroshima. No radiation, no byproduct of any kind, just pure energy. If your goal is really to help people, then a increase in education is a large step in that direction, you can find new ways to both provide for them, and defend them.
That's all I have on the subject, you can take the last word.
Last edited by Aram on Sat Mar 13, 2004 8:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 8:21 pm |
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Ammon777
Warrior for Heaven
Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 2011
Location: United States |
...
Last edited by Ammon777 on Sun Mar 14, 2004 1:02 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 8:31 pm |
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xSamhainx
Paws of Doom
Joined: 11 Sep 2002
Posts: 2192
Location: San Diego |
Hiya Roach!
The substance of my theorum was not whether or not the No Child Left behind program what this or that. Im trying really not to get into any of these knock down drag out arguments about policy. Been there, done that, Im not gonna beat a dead horse for the tenth time. My argument was with the fraud of someone posing as some poor little scared American child, cowering in some corner, who just cant get a fair shake. And of course, its all the societies' fault. Typical launching pad for the Left, use the image of a child. Who can argue against that?
quote:
Hey, I figured it out in 7th grade, each school‘s person funding is ..
Still, 7th grade isnt 5th grade. I dont know of any 5th graders that sit around moping about being a number, and worried about funding. I have a niece in 6th grade, and a sister who just started high school. And second, I find it hard to believe that some fresh high-schooler was all excited when he heard about the No Child Left Behind program. His hands clasped together at his chest, finally convinced that yes, his salvation has arrived. Come on!
And this obsession with Canada is kinda weird. Canada this, Canada that. Why north? Theres a southern border too, buddy. Why not go check out the University of Tijuana's Graduate Program for Gifted Children? Why not try out Cuba's excellent medical schools? You know they have one of the best medical systems in the world I hear. Free health care for all too, you can get right in and see a trained professional psychologist at a moments notice. And as an added bonus, they will also tell you what you can read, what you can write, and what you can listen to. You wont be troubled with all these swirling chaotic choices that no doubt plague you. Dont run off to Waterloo, go check out Havana, I think youll be happy with what you find.
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Simply look north to Canada, they have little need for military because they don’t piss everyone off! When was the last time someone declared war on Canada, when was there ever a time?
Come on, for being such a brilliant mind left behind, you dont even know your US/Canada history?
quote:
I've visited Canada before and it's amazing how much can change across a border. Everyone was kind, trusting, and helpful..............it was creepy.
Yeah, I bet. For being as mentally and physically incapacitated by the cruel un-strains of the US educational system, you are able to hop on over to Canada for a little visit. No doubt looking over your shoulder as you returned to the American Gulag, at the smiling and sad Canadian border guards, wiping tears away as your vehicle disappears into the dark, grey bowels of America. Hilarious!
Get this thru your head right now "Aram", Kerry will NOT be elected. As soon as you people on the other side of the aisle grow up and stop *acting like children*, the electorate will start listening to you. And not a moment before ='.'=
_________________
“Then away out in the woods I heard that kind of a sound that a ghost makes when it wants to tell about something that's on its mind and can't make itself understood, and so can't rest easy in its grave, and has to go about that way every night grieving.”-Mark Twain |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 8:37 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
*sigh*
First of all, public schools are not primarily funded through the federal government. Nor should they be, it's not the federal government's job. It's the job of local and state governments. So it should be no surprise that the federal government spends more on the military, which is one of their jobs.
Second, throwing more money at the problem won't solve it. There need to be a number of fundamental changes to the education system. Currently, it's the biggest babysitting business in the world and until that focus changes we'll just be flushing more money down the toliet.
Third, let's withdraw the claws people. There's no need to attack each other to make a point.
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound=  |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:21 pm |
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Aram
Village Dweller
Joined: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 23
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Ok, this is getting way out of hand.
Ammon, you have no idea how much time I spent last night looking through web sites about home schooling and talking to people who've tried it. I did listen to your advice, I've talked to ANOTHER doctor, and I still want opinions on what to do. I never meant to start an argument with anyone, Llama's attitude got on my nerves. Your right, there is no point to arguing, but it is a great way to blow off steam.
Sam, you have to understand that there is no tone of voice on message boards. I thought it would be a mistake to do this in the first place, because you only see what you mind wants. If you want to see me as some scared little boy who cowers in the corner, or a "victim" of the big bad oppressive system, then go ahead, but it's coming from you and not me. I cant stand people who simply criticize without offering solutions, I asked for advice and get nothing from you.
Cmckj50, Elkston, Korplem, Ammon, Corwin, and Roach. Thanks for your advice, I'm looking into everything you said and hope to hear more. For everything else, I'm staying silent. I'll answer any questions and give thanks, but nothing more. |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:22 pm |
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Ammon777
Warrior for Heaven
Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 2011
Location: United States |
okey.  |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:49 pm |
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Roach
SBR Belfry Bat
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 3233
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Ammon, cut the guy some slack, you’ve gone off more than once around here, we all do now and then. I don’t think I could name a regular around here, myself included, who hasn’t.
Sam man, I got your point, I just thought you were being a bit rough on ‘im.
Why Canada? It’s gotta be the mooses, everybody loves the mooses! 
Oh! And out of curiosity’s sake, as a member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy how much did you enjoy Dean’s downfall? I’m a proud centrist, and even I got a pretty good laugh out of it. |
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Sat Mar 13, 2004 10:02 pm |
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Llama
High Emperor
Joined: 11 Oct 2001
Posts: 509
Location: Earth |
quote:
Originally posted by Aram
That's all well and good Llama, we simply have different views. The topic is education though.
I just thought of one more thing to add and then I'm done with the foreign policies discussion. If the gun is more powerful than the brain, then remember it was the brain that invented the gun. If you want to look at it as pure domination over everyone, remember that the super powers are always the leaders in technology. If a higher education lead to anything, it would lead to an increase in the sciences, the same sciences that invent the weapons you love so much. Think of the things you can accomplish along those lines, new sources of energy, and new sources of weaponry. A good example of this is antimatter, a new energy source that it currently being researched. A ball of antimatter the size of a BB can power New York City for a day, and has the destructive power of the bomb dropped on Hiroshima. No radiation, no byproduct of any kind, just pure energy. If your goal is really to help people, then a increase in education is a large step in that direction, you can find new ways to both provide for them, and defend them.
That's all I have on the subject, you can take the last word.
Not really in this just to have the last word...
But the point you bring up, while valid raises a question. We are already researching these new technologies... Perhaps our education isn't as poor as you proclaim it is?
I guess I'll just echo what I said when I first responded to this thread. In grade school, you learn the basics and the most important lesson of all, the ability to socially interact with different types of people.
When you want "smarts", you go to college.
*edit*
quote:
Llama's attitude got on my nerves.
Sorry to hear that words on your computer monitor got on your nerves.
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tired of people's shit |
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Sun Mar 14, 2004 12:55 am |
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corwin
On the Razorblade of Life
Joined: 10 Jun 2002
Posts: 8376
Location: Australia |
Aram, I have years of experience in this area, albeit in a different country with a very different approach and attitude, but if I can be of any assistance, just PM me. I'm here every day. I have NO interest in American politics. (I hate Australian politics too, so don't be offended!!  )
_________________
If God said it, then that settles it!
I don't use Smileys, I use Emoticons!!
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Sun Mar 14, 2004 2:42 am |
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