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mtkafka
Village Dweller
Joined: 15 Jul 2001
Posts: 24
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The problem I have with NWN isn't with the game itself, but that the longevity of the game sorely depends on the players and fans. One of the 'good' things about MMRPG's is that, although they lack true roleplaying, you can play anytime. With NWN, for multiplayer, you really have to get a good group going to get something out of it. And beyond that, one of the players (the DM) has to be devoted enough to provide content for the players. Theres more work that has to be done to get a good session of NWN in, just like playing a pnp.
Having played about 6-8 hours total of NWN onlie, I can say its an uphill battle for NWN online to succeed. Its not the game thats a failure just that this concept of gameplay, pnp gameplay over the internet, has never been achived, and will be hard to make a reality for many players.
I originally liked the concept of NWN, but even before release I still thought it was a very hard concept to pull off. Theres just too much to consider to make it fly with players.
Anyway I think NWN is still a great game. It provides everything aplayer or future dm would need to have some fun. But again the work to get to the fun might be its drawbacks.
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Mon Jun 24, 2002 9:43 am |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
quote:
Originally posted by mtkafka
The problem I have with NWN isn't with the game itself, but that the longevity of the game sorely depends on the players and fans. One of the 'good' things about MMRPG's is that, although they lack true roleplaying, you can play anytime. With NWN, for multiplayer, you really have to get a good group going to get something out of it. And beyond that, one of the players (the DM) has to be devoted enough to provide content for the players. Theres more work that has to be done to get a good session of NWN in, just like playing a pnp.
Having played about 6-8 hours total of NWN onlie, I can say its an uphill battle for NWN online to succeed. Its not the game thats a failure just that this concept of gameplay, pnp gameplay over the internet, has never been achived, and will be hard to make a reality for many players.
Right now I would say people in the community are not sure what they have in their hands. But hey! It's not even been out a week yet! So let's generally calm down and be patient. No one said NWN's concept would be either easy to achieve, or that we would see the benefits of such a type of online play right away. As I said, most people now are not sure what they are playing yet.
I think we've been playing so many pseudo-RPGs online in the past (Diablo is one example) that we are collectively afraid to go back to the pnp style of gameplay that is D&D. No, NWN does not play like Diablo, or any other MMORPG for that matter, when you play online. Yes, it takes some preparation, and some work especially from the DM. Yes it'll take some time for a few good people to come out with fun modules to play with. But again people, the game has been on the shelves for about 6 days now!! Let's wait for the community to adjust before judging. Right now it isn't fair to say that NWN's weak point is the multiplayer. By all accounts, and from my limited experience online with it, it should be fantastic! But that's just a projection 
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Mon Jun 24, 2002 2:09 pm |
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Gaijin
Head Merchant
Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 62
Location: Montreal |
I think this is a breath of fresh air in the Online RPG genre. I mean, playing EQ and AO I really got the feeling that you had to put into the game to get out of it, and while that was fine, by the time my characters reached higher levels it just consisted of pulling in Mobs and level chasing..I tried everything to make AO something else for me...I was even an ARK for 2 months..but in the end the experience and all the time invested made me feel like I had been going through repetitive motions over and over.
NWN on the other hand could provide you with so much more if you're willing to put into it. When people start to get into the groove of using the DM kit and the modules start getting built, this game is going to be the "IT". I mean where else am I going to be able to get online with my old RPG buds who I can't table top with anymore, fire up a module and play...
Yes it's going to be a bit different than the Play Anytime apporach of the MMORPG, but in the end, the experience may justify the little bit of extra effort.
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We need a new bard. All this one does is sing and drink. |
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Mon Jun 24, 2002 2:34 pm |
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EverythingXen
Arch-villain
Joined: 01 Feb 2002
Posts: 4342
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I've probably played 20 or more hours online so far, and there are some very good user modules in beta testing. Right now it's people trying to get their act together, but the promise is there. ANd in some password protected games, actually, the promise is MET... the DM was preparing for this game for years now and just needed the tools to do it and in one day... boom... his entire campaign world was ready for his player to explore.
Edit: And yes... the game has only been out for less than a week. A week to figure out how to make a flawless module? Damn... I still haven't completely mastered the controls for playing characters. At least NWN SHIPPED with its online world editing tools unlike Dungeon Siege. And the DM client completely blows away DS scripting (how could it not?). I was fighting a few giant spiders and winning (though I shouldn't have been). Suddenly the spiders stopped trying to get through the AI pathfinding nightmare I'd led them to and very calmly split up, surrounded me, and navigated through the terrain.
Well, I had just enough time to hit the 'cuss' button for my characters voice set before I was spider chow. Then the DM appeared and said "Shame on you... picking on poor helpless AI constructs like that".
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Estuans interius, Ira vehementi
"The old world dies and with it the old ways. We will rebuild it as it should be, MUST be... Immortal!"
=Member of the Nonflamers Guild=
=Worshipper of the Written Word= |
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Mon Jun 24, 2002 2:55 pm |
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IDPuterGuy
Head Merchant
Joined: 26 May 2002
Posts: 61
Location: Idaho |
To play a prebuilt module will you need a DM? Or can you multi play without one? |
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Tue Jun 25, 2002 5:02 am |
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SuperCowMan24
Blademaster of the Moo
Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 1194
Location: Texas, USA |
im working on a module you can play without a DM, you just have to do a LOT of scripting, which i suck at... but it is turning out real well... its called the Fall of Forest Gate, Forest Gate is an underground elven forest, and it is attacked by orcs, and later... demons, actually in the mod you dont do a lot of the fighting, you end up seeing valient elves die defending their territory, then you are sent to take out an orc camp, but when you enter the city.... ahhhh... i dont wanna spoil it for anyone who wants to play it with me...
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Moo. Just do it, purse your lips and let out a MIGHTY MOO!
Don't you feel better now? |
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Tue Jun 25, 2002 5:09 am |
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stealth
Protector of the Realm
Joined: 23 Mar 2002
Posts: 261
Location: Valhalla |
@SuperCowMan24: Sounds interesting
I still haven’t touched the tools (besides for the BETA) yet. It is a little difficult working on a script while reading FR novels and playing NWN as much as possible.
I just thought about something. It is possible to just download pre-made module and fire it up just like the included SP game, right?
If you create a SP module (a couple of hours game play) without adding additional textures, sounds and so on. How large would such module be in size? I’m trying to get an idea about how much players need to download.
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=Shadow of the RPGDot Shadows=
=Member of The Sports Fans' Club= |
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Tue Jun 25, 2002 9:07 am |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
quote:
Originally posted by IDPuterGuy
To play a prebuilt module will you need a DM? Or can you multi play without one?
You can single-play, multi-play, DM-play any module of any kind here. It all depends on how it's been created. For instance, if the module creator didn't make a single script or dialogue for NPCs in his module because he/she is planning on DMing the entire thing in multi-player, then you would be hard pressed to play it alone. But if the creator made scripts for NPCs, and prepared encounters before hand, then there is no reason why you couldn't play it alone as well as in multi-player mode.
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Tue Jun 25, 2002 4:30 pm |
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IDPuterGuy
Head Merchant
Joined: 26 May 2002
Posts: 61
Location: Idaho |
Can someone create some kick ass modules and sell them? Wonder if Bioware would care? That would be awesome incentive to expand the game. Might be hard to copy protect though? Wonder if they have already thought about this. Maybe they will do it themselves? Somehow I just get the feeling this is going to be a big game. Wonder if Bioware will release a full scripting manual for this bad boy? |
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Wed Jun 26, 2002 1:18 am |
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EverythingXen
Arch-villain
Joined: 01 Feb 2002
Posts: 4342
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Nope. it's covered in the EULA just like Morrowind's. Any module or modification you create is the legal property of Bioware, Atari, et all. You can't sell them to make money any more than you can sell mods to Morrowind or a custom UI for Jedi Knight II, etc.
For that you need to purchase the rights to use the engine off them.
_________________
Estuans interius, Ira vehementi
"The old world dies and with it the old ways. We will rebuild it as it should be, MUST be... Immortal!"
=Member of the Nonflamers Guild=
=Worshipper of the Written Word= |
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Wed Jun 26, 2002 2:25 am |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
| Re: Can you sell modules? |
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quote:
Originally posted by IDPuterGuy
Wonder if Bioware will release a full scripting manual for this bad boy?
The scripting language used in the Aurora Toolset is "C" language, or something VERY similar to it. If you want a book for it, the Module bulding guide book is a pretty good place to start, or learn the "C" programming language
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Wed Jun 26, 2002 7:41 pm |
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IDPuterGuy
Head Merchant
Joined: 26 May 2002
Posts: 61
Location: Idaho |
It probably is C++ as I'm pretty sure that's what the game is written in. That's not a problem there but you still need to know the syntax, classes and methods to use. It would be like knowing VB and trying to program ASP without any reference. Sure you know VB Script but you don't know the ASP components. Not that I'm going to take the time to learn it but it's interesting... |
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Thu Jun 27, 2002 1:30 am |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
I'm currently trying to get a basic knowledge of the scripting language (I am NOT a programmer! hehe) and it's not too bad. If you want to know how to use the syntax, you can always refer to the campaign modules from Bioware that come with the game and look at the scripts they created. Also, the guide book (the module making one, not the adventurer's Guide) is very neat and spends a lengthy amount of its pages describing and explaining scripting and how to use it. You might want to get it.
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=Member of The Nonflamers' Guild=
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Thu Jun 27, 2002 5:02 pm |
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Northchild
Fearless Paladin
Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 232
Location: New York, USA |
Definitely thinking about getting the builders guide. Online play in NWN so far has been a mixed bag for me, but I think that's only until I get together with some people here. I've had some decent sessions with people I don't know online, but I've also had a couple of sessions where the kiddies are yelling back and forth "HAS ANY1 CLEARED THE DOCKS??!!" and "DOES ANY1 WANTTO TRADE FOR THIS ITEM??!!" A couple of players were typing "Heh" so often that I felt like I was gaming with Beavis and Butthead. |
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Thu Jun 27, 2002 6:03 pm |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
Hey! I say "heh" often, and I'm far from being a child... unfortunately... 
Anyway... NC, one piece of advice to you (and anyone else planning on buying it) about the Module Building Guide book though: If you want to learn scripting, it's a good place to start. But if you just want to build things and place encounters and control everything else with the DM client, then it's a waste of money. To give you a relative idea, the book has a total of over 200 pages. The only chapters that don't concern scripting specifically are chapters 1 and 2, and together they represent about 25 pages only. The rest is all scripting related. So if you don't feel like creating self running events in your modules, it might not be your cup of tea. Instead, try Bioware's own free tutorial here: http://nwn.bioware.com/builders/modtutorial.html, and download the PDF file. It's 36 pages and seem to cover mostly every aspect of module creating, even slightly touching on the basic scripting issues.
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=Member of The Nonflamers' Guild=
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Thu Jun 27, 2002 6:31 pm |
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