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Archaven
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Posts: 30
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Ok right now I am all setted with five characters, Fighter, Samurai, Ranger, Priest and Mage. I've finally convinced to have a bard into my party after reading all those specialties that a bard provides. Now, my question would be, if bard would be able to cast mage spells, does pumping points to Piety helps the bard since it provides more spell points? I guess this would be my final party before i start the game.
Thanks again for the patience. |
Tue Feb 04, 2003 4:38 am |
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otter
One of Us
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 1337
Location: Portland, OR |
Piety does NOT help your Priest cast better, it only helps with learning faster. You can save your points to spend on Dex, Str, and Con by practising more outside of combat, and with Magic Nectar and Mana Stones, you don't need more SP recovery than your starting Piety gives you.
The Bonus Skill Reflextion (from maxing Dex) is a very useful effect (AC +1 upon opening, then 1 more every 20). Powerstrike (STR 100) was somewhat helpful, in my trio of Fighters i maxed a different Attribute first for each one, and the one with Powerstrike got more kills. The other Bonus Skills have little to contribute; by the time you get them, your equipment is likely to obviate their effects. (Powercast, from maxing Int, made very little difference to me until i got it over 70, and by then everyone was doing much more damage with weapons than with magic; Magic Resistance over 100 is a waste, and there are many objects which will bring you up there; Amulets of Healing make high Vit moot; even your designated Haster will do fine on no more than 80 Spd; and everyone was already hitting almost everything they shot at before anyone got Eagle Eye.)
I've never run a straight Priest or Mage--the only magic i rely on (aside from Alchemy for potion-mixing bux) has been protection from magic, and you can get all 3 of these with a Bard and any of the 4 Alchemy-capables. Alchemy is also the only School with a L6 mass instakill spell. (and it works on almost everything).
More SP from Piety is kinda a waste; if you read all the Spellbooks available for your caster, just learning the spells gives you plenty of SP. And however much practise you have patience for will increase your Realm and School skills to give you yet more.
_________________
If thousand-year-old family traditions are so important to you, why do you have indoor plumbing and electricity in your family's house? |
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Tue Feb 04, 2003 5:21 am |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
quote:
Originally posted by Archaven
Now, my question would be, if bard would be able to cast mage spells, does pumping points to Piety helps the bard since it provides more spell points?
A bard's music uses stamina instead of mana. The bard doesn't actually cast any spells- he uses items that have spell-like effects. Using those items takes stamina. Since you'll be using your bard as your locks-n-traps guy, I'd recommend the following plan. Pump points into INT, DEX, and VIT. Build up Music, L-n-T, and some sort of combat skills. Bards can actually be pretty good front-line combat guys by the end of the game if you develop them that way. With my first winning party, my bard brought up the rear and became quite skilled with a bow. What combat you want to emphasize is up to you.
Your party looks great. Dig in, have fun, and feel free to ask questions if you have any.
_________________
=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Tue Feb 04, 2003 3:12 pm |
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otter
One of Us
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 1337
Location: Portland, OR |
INT helps only with learning faster. It's possible to crank a Bard's Music score to 100 at L1 with extensive boring practising, but within that extreme, you can use those precious Attribute points elsewhere (STR) to whatever extent you have patience to let your Bard do what she must, just like any mundane musician. Music Skill and Bard Level are what determine how well you play, not INT.
S
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Using the Viola d'Amore, which you get in Arnika. Same effect as casting Charm, but Music goes up faster than Psi or Div and Mental. (and if you wear 2 Endurance necklaces from the Temple Basement, your Stamina goes back up in a second)
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If thousand-year-old family traditions are so important to you, why do you have indoor plumbing and electricity in your family's house? |
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Tue Feb 04, 2003 11:59 pm |
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Bilbo
High Emperor
Joined: 12 Mar 2002
Posts: 1620
Location: New York |
Otter is wrong in his last post (gasp!), but had it right in his earlier one. Per the manual, piety (not intelligence) affects how quickly your skills improve on their own. Intelligence affects how good your characters for certain things. Other than for priest / bishop / lord / valkyrie classes, I do NOT up my piety. And I ignore speed until later.
With all my character, I always pump up vitality. So for a mage, I always give +3 INT and +3 VIT at level up. For hybrids, I tend to split the points between their main attributes (ex: samurai = strength for fighting + intelligence for casting) and vitality +2/+2/+2, with some variation. I think there are bonuses on the "5s" and "0s" - so rather that leave a character at say 59, I'll give him/her an extra point to make it 60 and not give one to another skill.
Bards did cast mage spells back in Wiz7. In fact, my bard in Wiz8 was a faerie precisely because she was imported from Wiz7. However, since they no longer cast spells in that manner, I don't recommend a faerie bard for stamina reasons. But it just goes to show you that even a non-optimal class choice can work out. My bard was pumped up with intelligence (which affects musical ability) and vitality, and later dexterity. Since your bard will be your thief, you'll want to focus on putting points towards L&T; that's why I put off dexterity since I was putting points here (dexterity affects your chance of success, not just your L&T skill). Of course, you bard could be trained to become more of a fighter, in which case you might want to consider extra strength. While my bard was a ranged weapon from the rear, my gadgie (next party) was on the front line fighting with a Blade Cuisinart! It's all in how you want to develop your party.
For my fighter-types on the front, I always put points into specific weapon skills (e.g. sword and bow) until they were about 20+, and then focused on close combat and ranged combat. Your fighters will train themselves very well in these 4 areas (close weapon, ranged weapon, close combat, ranged combat) over time, provided you consistently use the same type of weapons. Then I tended to pump points into those that we falling behind the others. So if I was building a fighter to use a sword and a bow, I'd focus on where he was the weakest!
Reminder: with all skills, at level up you can't increase them beyond 75. From 76-100 must be acquired with training.
And any way you choose to do it, you can still win the game.
_________________
The world itself shifts and changes and fades to mist like the strings of a minstrel's harp, and mayhap the dreams we forge are more enduring than the works of kings and gods.-Robert E. Howard
=Member of the RPGDot Shadows, The Nonflamers' Guild, and The Alliance of Middle Earth= |
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Wed Feb 05, 2003 1:37 am |
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otter
One of Us
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 1337
Location: Portland, OR |
Sorry, Bilbo, but i am certain of this:
The Wiz-8 manual is very misleading in many places (Gasp!) If you right-click on any skill (the text of its name in the Character Inventory, screen 3)
it will tell you what the attributes are which help you learn it.
The manual only states for Piety that it helps you learn "...in all realms." which means the six elemental realms of Divinity. (well, in any School, but here they're specifically talking about Div)
Neither Piety nor Intelligence have any determination on how effective a spell will be, except that Int can get you to Powercast (which does not boost Divine spells).
_________________
If thousand-year-old family traditions are so important to you, why do you have indoor plumbing and electricity in your family's house? |
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Wed Feb 05, 2003 4:57 am |
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Archaven
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Posts: 30
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The overall game is fun especially with instakill/lightning strike/critical strike. But the combat is too slow!. I would like the speed patch. Can anyone send to me? Thanks. |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 12:38 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
Sent.
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound=  |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 3:57 pm |
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Archaven
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Posts: 30
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Thanks val. Hope it doesn't contain any virus  . Nah just joking.. Thanks  . |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 5:19 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
If there had been a virus, then you wouldn't be replying.
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound= |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 6:31 pm |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
Give a mod a little ribbing about being scarce, and now she's taking over our little kingdom... 
_________________
=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 7:07 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound= |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 7:10 pm |
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the mighty stamar
High Emperor
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Posts: 602
Location: arcata ca, humboldt county |
Is there any online source for this speed patch? Id like it too.
Right now my dudes are all level 10 and Im doing the Trynton quests. Really cool part of the game I think.
Here is my party
catSamurai( just like archhavens it seems to suck)
lizardfighter( he has the most kills by far, he is Ugh master)
Dracon priest
elf bard
gnome gadgeteer
faerie mage
The two npcs Im using are the valkrie and the ranger. I need them too I need more fighters. And I dig sparkles little sound bites. |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 11:26 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
Sent.
Sorry, there's nowhere online to get it.
_________________
Freeeeeeedom! Thank heavens it's summer!
What do I have to show for my hard work? A piece of paper! Wee!
=Guardian, Moderator, UltimaDot Newshound= |
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Thu Feb 06, 2003 11:41 pm |
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otter
One of Us
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 1337
Location: Portland, OR |
Sam's are great, but they take a little effort: their Sword bonus makes up for much of the off-hand malus, and there are some very nice Sam-only swords for both hands. If your load level is white, and they have high Dex and are Hasted, they'll get plenty Lightning Strikes, and their Crit potential helps me often at the most interesting times.
_________________
If thousand-year-old family traditions are so important to you, why do you have indoor plumbing and electricity in your family's house? |
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Fri Feb 07, 2003 3:07 am |
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