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Ragnar
High Emperor
Joined: 30 Oct 2001
Posts: 486
Location: NJ USA |
Well...If you would like some help just let me know. I might be able to host a file upload/download site on on of my servers here at work. Or maybe we can rent some space on this site...just to keep it local.
_________________
"That one hurt..."
Sylvio |
Tue Jul 15, 2003 9:41 pm |
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Xerxes712
High Emperor
Joined: 01 Nov 2002
Posts: 605
Location: Uber die Welt |
Thanks; I will try to ask the moderators if they can make us a modders sticky thread, and I will send you my file MODs as I finish them to get something posted.
It will keep the game going and wait until they see; it will not be a cake walk easy to finish the game any more...talk to you later, back to modding and testing these changes for balance. 
_________________
Wo ist mein Sumpfkraut? |
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Tue Jul 15, 2003 9:49 pm |
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Daedalus
High Emperor
Joined: 04 Jan 2002
Posts: 2516
Location: Estonia |
heheh nice work Xerxes 
and Ragnar check out Gothic 1 sections u find some info from there where to get mods some of them are even with voice acting i like that and one had even an very ollld rifle go check them out |
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Tue Jul 15, 2003 10:54 pm |
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OctU
Keeper of the Gates
Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Posts: 114
Location: On an island beyond the realm of the Sea Barons |
Xerxes,
A wonderful gesture on your part, offering your time and energy to make an incredible game even better.
Many mods simply present new quests, items or creatures, and do not attempt to change any of the game stats or mechanics. It's great to see that you are actively soliciting recommendations for game improvements and attempting to remedy some of the weaknesses that many of our forum members found in Gothic 2.
Man o man, if only you could find a way to decompile the EXE and tweak the AI to make creatures take alternate paths when stuck! You make it sound like tweaking the AI to do this would be rather straight-forward and easy, and if so, how could the PB developers have overlooked it?
Anyway, your efforts are a fantastic contribution to the Gothic community, really terrific. Long live Xerxes! |
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Tue Jul 15, 2003 10:58 pm |
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Ragon
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Posts: 41
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| Re: Edit all the weapons and everything's stats. |
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quote:
Originally posted by Xerxes712
... the Persian king´s observation on weapon´s damage, esp. non-critters inflicting only minor one and always the same on enemies...
Well, yes and no. Not quite!
Here´s a link to the status of the (almost  ) scientific research on weapon´s mechanics and the combat system in Gothic II as conducted by the german community, which obviously has come up with similar new findings on the matter only recently:
Folteraxt kontra Orkschlächter
There seem to be additional tresholds for increases of the `minimum damage´ you noticed, weapon dependent on top of it. But it appears to be indeed miles away from what critical hits do to your enemy.
It should all become clear from the posted test samples. If i find the time, i´ll maybe translate the rest occasionally.
All in all, it actually does look quite intentional from the dev´s side, not buggy.
Gtx,
Ragon, the Mage |
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Wed Jul 16, 2003 5:01 pm |
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konny666
Noble Knight
Joined: 03 Jul 2003
Posts: 219
Location: Babylon 6 |
Yeah it was probably done that way for game balance.
As we all are well aware, Gothic 2 is indeed well-balanced until you reach Chapters 5 and 6, and maybe chapter 4 (depending on your char. & how much time you spend messing about in chaps 1-3) |
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Wed Jul 16, 2003 5:29 pm |
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Ragnar
High Emperor
Joined: 30 Oct 2001
Posts: 486
Location: NJ USA |
I noticed something else last night that I think could stand some tweaking. I am at Dex 125 and can pickpocket with impunity. That in itself is not that bad but I think some kind random flag should be introduced as to whether the person being ripped off notices. If he does notice…then there should be some kind of penalty imposed on you. Now it can’t be a fine or time in the slammer because the victim will not be able to prove it, but I could be that he/she bad mouths you all over town or will not give you or complete a quest…or something to that nature.
I also think that creatures should be reintroduced when you move into a new chapter..But…in order to keep things in balance we make them immortal. The land just doesn’t feel right with all the critters missing. You run around and hear wildlife but nothing is there…very weird. This would be basically a game enhancement to make it feel like it is a living world. Right now I feel like I’m running around in a world that better fits into ‘The Twilight Zone’ than Gothic.
_________________
"That one hurt..."
Sylvio |
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Wed Jul 16, 2003 6:26 pm |
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hammermd23
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 26 Oct 2002
Posts: 48
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Xerxes:
This is terrific news! Where can I download your English text fix mod? The translation errors are bugging me!
Thanks,
hammermd |
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Wed Jul 16, 2003 8:18 pm |
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konny666
Noble Knight
Joined: 03 Jul 2003
Posts: 219
Location: Babylon 6 |
"But…in order to keep things in balance we make them immortal."
Huh? WTF is the point then? Having immortal, unkillable creatures which have no relation to the storyline would be a waste of memory and nothing more than "eye candy" ... and barely that. |
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Thu Jul 17, 2003 5:24 am |
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Daedalus
High Emperor
Joined: 04 Jan 2002
Posts: 2516
Location: Estonia |
naah he means like if we kill one of them and go away from that place long away and come back then the same creature is there again i think that would suck cos Diablo 2 sucked that way i didnt like it becose of that thing and also morrowind has the same thing they coming back in the same place again |
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Thu Jul 17, 2003 11:57 am |
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konny666
Noble Knight
Joined: 03 Jul 2003
Posts: 219
Location: Babylon 6 |
Hey well if thats what he meant ok then. Well, that still might not be too good. if someone wants easy XPs they can just keep coming back and killing it.
HOWEVER to add so-called "realism" there is one area we can have recurring random monsters... during the night! I think that when the clock hits 9:00pm or whatever, random monsters start appearing all over the countryside, making it more dangerous and tense to run around at night, especially without a torch or a Light spell ! I think that'd be cool. |
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Thu Jul 17, 2003 4:31 pm |
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Ragnar
High Emperor
Joined: 30 Oct 2001
Posts: 486
Location: NJ USA |
My point is this…and I think I stated it pretty well. By chptr. 5 the critters in both territories were pretty much hunted to extinction. I was running around in a waist land devoid of all animal life and I didn’t like it. I thought that having the wildlife reintroduced during a chptr change would help the game keep the feeling of a living world. I don’t know about you, but I try to immerse myself in the games I play. I let the game pull me in to their specific environment and the better the game the more I 'Become one with the game'. The fact that I wasleft running around in a barren landscape blows…IMO. Let me put it this way; last night when I opened the gate and witnessed all the carnage that ensued because of my action, it took about an hour for the guilt and remorse I felt, to wear off. I almost reloaded the game to sidestep that moment.
It is strictly to enhance the feel of the game…so it feels right. I don’t give a rats ass about how much memory it eats up…It can’t eat up any more that it does when you start the game unless you go overboard and put in a zillion creatures. And the idea of making them immortal or almost immortal would prevent people from exploiting this just to level up and make it a real challenge to move around knowing that that warg just off the trail will probably kill you if he spots you.
I thought this thread was to point out deficiencies in the game and discuss ways to improve it…shooting down someone’s ideas as being shitty or ludicrous can only stagnate this thread and limit the ideas that people might want to present in this discussion.
_________________
"That one hurt..."
Sylvio |
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Thu Jul 17, 2003 7:46 pm |
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Xerxes712
High Emperor
Joined: 01 Nov 2002
Posts: 605
Location: Uber die Welt |
@Ragon
Good info, about the same I see. Untrained at 10% roughly all weapons do the same 5 base hit NORMAL damage. You get a bonus to normal damage of roughly Strength/10.
So my Weapon (NO MATTER WHAT IS THE DAMAGE POTENTIAL) will always do this (roughly) basic damage on a normal hit with no training.
(5 + STR/10) - (Armor/10) = Normal damage hit. ALL weapons roughly.
So a Two Handed Palidan sword normal hit with just the STR to hit is minimum 40 to carry it. You will get a Normal hit of 5 + 40/10 = 9 damage.
The formula is only rough and differs below about 30? weapon or strength some. Generally the formula is correct.
Armor does the same in reduction by (ARMOR/10)=reduction. So if I hit a animal with armor of 40, it will reduce the damage by 4. So my sword is doing about 9-4=5 damage. If I hit a zero armor, I get the full 9 hit damage.
This seems strange and not right. Training is the most important skill and strength is very important to get the bonus damage.
As far as a normal hit, that 5 to 15 damage is about it minus some target armor. Any kind of training say to 60% will go right through and do the huge damage of weapon rated damage plus strength on a critical hit. Of course minus the armor which is taken a full.
Critical hit damage = (Weapon + STR) - (ARMOR)
I have found extra data in the game.dat file when I was modify weapons; I think this extra date is the level break and STR bonus damge on normal hits stored there. Numbers like 1, 3, 6, 9 odd pop up. The file is compiled and I could not figure out what they are doing.
I think the training aspects of this game is very overbearing. The normal damage is doing very little it seems compared to critical hits.
@Ragnor and Konny666 Animal discussion:
I need to figure out the combat mechanics fully for reason above before I MOD animal data. I want to keep some animals around for killing later in game chapters. I effectively want to achieve this by making certain animals very hard to kill, so that you really need to move on to new levels and chapters to kill them all. All monsters and 'boss' types will be very tough to kill. I want to do this in a clever way to make it interesting. First try is to change animal armor, damage, level, hitpoints, attributes, mana, and even the spells they cast for dragons and such daemons.
Animal respawns is via script and is more complicated, I just want to get a working simple MOD first. AI script is there also; you can even play with it via the old Gothic mod kit to a certain extent. Also, the cheat consule has a command to adjust AI script in game to see what effects it has.
The Super animals can be killed with a bow from a distance; but you will use up all arrows in game trying to this sniping from a distance. I want the game tougher; I like the input you are all giving me, by talking we can come up with good ideas. Keep up with the discussions helps get a clear picture. Also, some spells never get used and weapons 2 hand seem weak. Boost them with tougher NPC and monsters may be the way to go. I apreciate the input.
_________________
Wo ist mein Sumpfkraut? |
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Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:22 am |
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Daedalus
High Emperor
Joined: 04 Jan 2002
Posts: 2516
Location: Estonia |
also some houses in forrest would be cool right now they are too empty |
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Fri Jul 18, 2003 11:08 am |
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Ragnar
High Emperor
Joined: 30 Oct 2001
Posts: 486
Location: NJ USA |
Well…it looks like modeling is out of the question for me. At least for now, I found out how much 3D Studio goes for... 
Zerxes712, how do you think giving people objects they could use is handled? Remember in cptr 5 you could take Biff or whoever, hunting for the dragons with you? As he took damage you could give him potions to heal him after a fight…but I noticed last night that Cor Angar does not have that option so I took him back to the ship to live another day. It would be nice to be able to give him potions also. How involved do you think it is? Another nice feature would be some kind of proximity thing attached to your partner so when you run away, he will follow after you reach a certain distance. Right now he will stay and fight in a ‘kill or be killed’ situation. While being very noble, it is also very stupid.
_________________
"That one hurt..."
Sylvio |
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Fri Jul 18, 2003 6:06 pm |
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