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Doc
Village Dweller
Joined: 16 Sep 2002
Posts: 4
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I'm sorry i have to wast valuable web space here but, rant mod ON
I am so god damn tired of the same world with the same creatures in it. I swear to god i'm killed the same god damn goblin in almost every RPG. But wait theirs more! I mean sure you can have a good game with a fantasy setting but eventualy it just gets old. Never Witner Nights is a game i would have loved if i hadn't sworn that i've been through that same exact city that NWN starts. Fallout was a great game because of its gameplay and SETTING! I didn't find a single elf or goblin in the entire game. And you know what i smiled because it was new and fresh and wasn't like your typical RPG. With the introducion of technology Arcanum was new but.... not want i was looking for. DOn't get me wrong i think that technology seperate the game from the rest of the crowed drasticly. I mean how many times do you have to "live your destiny"? How about a RPG in Kansas durring the 1850s when it "bleed" with open war between abolitionists and slave holders? Or how about one in Rome durring brutes plot to kill ceaser? Or your a human in the post bronze age where tribes are just forming? The wealth of our own history could produce countless games each one unique. Or use your imagination and invent your own world. How about a world where completly different different species live and raciel tensions are at a braking point? Hell a RPG were you play a white blood cell could be cool. BUT PLEASE FOR GOD SAKES NOT MORE CASTLES IN THE SKY!!!!
next rant..... Real CHaracter Development |
Sat Jan 11, 2003 7:21 am |
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Remus
Overgrown Cat
Joined: 03 Jul 2002
Posts: 1657
Location: Fish bowl |
I am sure many RPGs players aware about this. But strangely enough a lot of players still like medieval setting, or at least won't protest about it. Me personally do like more variety of RPG settings - and i like Fallout too. That's also why i'm quite excited with Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic, single player ONLY RPG - and hope BIOWARE won't mess it out again like NWN SP portion of the game.
Beside the fact that many RPGs players themselves don't mind the unoriginal medieval setting, another factor is that the setting is more easy to design or create by developers. We have readily available Advance D&D rule sets from Forgotten Realms universe - thus we need more, new, or better rule sets for other unconventional settings. It's not easy, even when some developer like Troika try to made a rather different setting, it was still influenced by sword + sorcery elements. |
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Sat Jan 11, 2003 8:08 am |
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Hexy
High Emperor
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 621
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I usually don't mind settings, I still enjoy medieval environments, but I also liked games like Fallout, Arcanum and Deus Ex.
One thing I don't like is games based upon movies and books (like Star Wars etc.)
Seriously, why can't developers be creative and create their own worlds?
For example: SW: KotoR and SW:G just play off the Star Wars popularity, it would've been cooler if the developers had invented their own universes.
Same thing goes for all these upcoming Middle Eart games, I already dislike them.
_________________
Like some bold seer in a trance;
Seeing all his own mischance |
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Sat Jan 11, 2003 11:19 am |
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Lorgosin
Head Merchant
Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Posts: 69
Location: Sweden |
I don't mind fantasy, but I like variety. The basic problem here I think is, as has been said before, that other settings sell poorly. Only the RPG "snobs" buy them. I don't really think this depends only on the setting though (I'll explain). In the 80's the SciFi RPGs were almost as numerous as the fantasy ones and were very successfull. All it usually takes is a few poorly selling games to make developers stay away from a genre (look at adventure games). It seems like noone has even made a serius attempt to make an RPG with an alternative setting that appeals to the casual gamer after their mysterious disappearance around 1990. I mean, Fallout was great but only a hardcore RPG-player would stay with it long enough for it to even get good. Most RPG's that sold to a broad audience were ones that were instantly impressive from the moment you started (BG, MW, NWN). Can you honestly say that you have found any non-fantasy RPG instantly impressive in later years? Another problem might be that after the decline of RPG's in the early 90's any venture into this almost shunned area had to at least be of the best selling setting (fantasy). Maybe the developers just got stuck in a way of thinking that dates back to the days when we didn't see the success for RPGs we see today. I just wonder if it's possible to get the casual gamer to play non-fantasy RPGs now that they have a reputation of beeng hard and heavy, and not very pretty (I don't mind that, but they might). Alternative settings are basically the RPG equivalent of Dostojevsky, people think that those without a special interest need not apply. I'm glad to see that this may change though as two very successful and respected companies are releasing alternative setting RPGs next year. I'm of course talking about KotOR and Sea Dogs 2. Hopefully this will make publishers realise that players want different settings. Some of the settings that doc mentioned really appealed to me (Roman, post bronze age) and I hope to be able to play them soon. I'll still need my occational fantasy fix though. |
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Sat Jan 11, 2003 12:54 pm |
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shai_aus
Village Leader
Joined: 18 Aug 2002
Posts: 97
Location: Australia |
[quote="Remus"]...and hope BIOWARE won't mess it out again like NWN SP portion of the game.[quote]
I'd just like to point out that Bioware made NWN with co-op multiplayer in mind. You know, like pen and paper D&D only without the pen and paper.
What's more, their single player campaign was never meant to be anything epic like the BG or PS:T single player game. It was merely a demonstration of what could be done with the Aurora toolset. The value of NWN will (hopefully) increase over time as skilled gamers create their own mods and adventures. |
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Sun Jan 12, 2003 3:23 am |
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Doc
Village Dweller
Joined: 16 Sep 2002
Posts: 4
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Listen Bioware chose to have a single player compaign so it should of been of the highest quality that they could make it. And the truth is its a good game. But it seems likei already own it cause i get the exact same experince playing Arcanum or BG2. And although some of the user created moduls are good and find more rough then diamond. Yes the comming years do look good and Eon of Tears is a game i'm dieing for. But then again theirs rumors of it being canceled because of a splitin the developers and Call of Cthul looks damn good. But compare it to the amount of RPGs being devloped (esspecialy MMORPGs) and its only a small percent. I'm damn tired of going to worlds were magic an't to magical considering how many people know about it and how to use it, and Elves and Dwarves are always unlike each other, and for some odd reason everyone wants me to deliver things for them. One of the biggest beefs i have with RPGs is that nearly all the unrequired missions are FedEx. Or its FedEx with "bad guys" in the way. And for games famed on their stories actualy character development (meaning that the character your playing actual changes in what he believes, not stats) is either sparce or just not included. I mean in BG2 if you started to posses massive amounts of power your telling me you wouldn't do one bad thing for your self? But no your either the devil or a saint in these types of games their arn't any shades. I mean don't get me wrong i love RPGs and i think that they are great games but right now their stagnating. Sure graphics are getting better but everything else stays the same. |
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Sun Jan 12, 2003 5:35 am |
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NidPuterGuy
Fearless Paladin
Joined: 08 Jan 2003
Posts: 237
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Someone above mentioned how Bioware created the game so that people could roll there own modules and multi play. Lets start out saying the single player was very poor. Semi enjoyable, not replayable, repetitive. The touted toolset is to hard to use. For a game that was built for the Aurora toolset they didn't even include a programming guide! WTF! It is based on C++ and they didn't even try to use the simplest code examples possible. You have to figure out their boolean logic to. Nobobdy but a decent programmer with lots of time on their hands or a Bioware developer could script a module well. This game was pure hype. $$$. Anyone can believe what they want but the truth is not many NWN purchasers will be buying any more Bioware software on release. I for one will watch what they make and they better have a demo before I buy their crap again! |
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Mon Jan 13, 2003 4:08 am |
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xSamhainx
Paws of Doom
Joined: 11 Sep 2002
Posts: 2192
Location: San Diego |
Yes, I can relate to the "Oh crap, i need to know C++ to do this?" I was kinda let down, and really pissed that they didnt have a manual of any real significance. But, over time, I saw the totally massive community sites that were up, with just tons and tons of scripts and sample scipts, and I saw BioWare doing alot to try and make it right. Message boards and all that, if'n you really want to know how to do it you can piece it together, even copy and paste scripts and tweak them. I ended up liking it, it has gotten me into programming now, learning Visual Basic an all that.
They did kinda misrepresent the whole thing tho, from the way it was presented from the first press release, it sounded all "drag and drop" and wizards. They did have a conversation wizard, which you can use for scripts as well, which I found helpful. Anyway, they have been adding tons of content since the release, in fact the last patch had a "plot wizard" in the editor, where you basically fill in the names and items, and it scripts the plot for you. This should have been in the official 1.0 release, but hey better late then never i guess. Maybe they should get a dirty look or two for the initial release, but I personally have never seen a company follow up with so much new content and support, go check out the official site, they are pretty dilligent. I wouldnt hesitate to buy any of their future stuff.
PS- You can play the single player campaign on "hard" difficulty and it's alot better, Ive found. Anything other than that is just too easy, gets boring quick when everything takes two whacks/arrows/one fireball to kill
_________________
“Then away out in the woods I heard that kind of a sound that a ghost makes when it wants to tell about something that's on its mind and can't make itself understood, and so can't rest easy in its grave, and has to go about that way every night grieving.”-Mark Twain |
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Mon Jan 13, 2003 5:32 am |
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