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horst wessel
Head Merchant
Joined: 13 Dec 2005
Posts: 56
Location: Toronto |
I found Vampire the Bloodlines controls and interface far worse, than G2. But it only took me an hour to get use to... No, I never even thought G2 had any problems with interface. The only problem with that game is the fact that it has an end. |
Fri Feb 03, 2006 1:49 am |
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Jvizzle
Village Dweller
Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 9
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call me a noob but whats the differnce between gothic2, gothic 2 gold, and NotR
i thought NotR was the expansion to gothic2 wich brought the new world with the ancient stone people. And gothic 2 gold was like a bundle edition of them together. I have no idea this is what i gather from playing the game wich i bought off the shelf 4 days ago and am really enjoying so far. |
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Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:59 pm |
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Gorath
Mostly Harmless
Joined: 03 Sep 2001
Posts: 6327
Location: NRW, Germany |
There´s a thread in the spoiler forum describing the differences. You can also find the most important ones in my review. The add-on changed the whole game mechanics.
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Webmaster GothicDot |
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Mon Feb 06, 2006 1:54 am |
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Sem
Solid as a Rock
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 3386
Location: at the Dot |
quote:
Originally posted by Jvizzle
i thought NotR was the expansion to gothic2 wich brought the new world with the ancient stone people. And gothic 2 gold was like a bundle edition of them together.
That's correct. NotR is fully integrated into Gothic 2, so you've probably seen some small changes already. New npc's, new items, etc. The new world will be available as soon as you've entered the second chapter.
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"Who are we to call this planet Earth, when it's clearly Ocean."
-- News Editor of GothicDot --
-- Moderator of the RPGDot Shadows --
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Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:41 pm |
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GTaher
Village Dweller
Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Posts: 20
Location: Alexandria, Egypt |
Unless, like many of the people who have posted on this forum, you either:
1) Haven't installed the last disc in the gold pack, which is NoTR
2) Have clicked on the Gothic 2 (rather than Gothic 2 NoTR) desktop icon and are therefore still playing Gothic 2 without NoTR
It was great without NoTR and is even better with the expansion!
Best. RPG. Ever. |
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Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:49 pm |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
quote:
Originally posted by horst wessel
No, I never even thought G2 had any problems with interface. The only problem with that game is the fact that it has an end.
I mean no offense, but that kind of "fanboy" praise is just as harmful as people not giving the game a chance. Gothic is *not* perfect. It is flawed genius. If you give people the impression that it *is* perfect, when they play it and get frustrated with the interface etc, they may just decide that you don't know what you're talking about and decide to just stop playing.
Make people aware of the hurdles they will face when first playing and reassure them of the wonders that await afterwards.
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:14 pm |
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Gotit
Captain of the Guard
Joined: 27 Nov 2005
Posts: 183
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You aren't wrong but those interface problem is a special thing. The truth is that it isn't mainstream, that's all, but this is really disturbing at first. But, for example, unlimited inventory is just a great feature, it avoids many little very boring managements that have many RPG games.
Do that with an interface with a mouse with scrollbar and all the stuff and you'll get a crap in comparison with the current choice.
It's still true that the interface is quite disturbing because not mainstream when you start play the game. But the truth is that it doesn't take that long to get used to most of its design choices.
That said, all best games I know are also far to be perfect, Gothic 2 isn't an exception.
Also even if in its way it is unique, it is also in the tradition of a long series of RPG and you can get some features and compare, not the whole, but only some features to other RPG. And for comparison like that, Gothic 2 won't be a as good on many features. But the whole is dam impressive.
Also common, computer RPG isn't a true mainstream category, RPG require involvement that cannot offer most players. Who really played it and didn't enjoyed it? Then what other RPG those people played? Diablo 2?  |
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Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:48 pm |
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Gotit
Captain of the Guard
Joined: 27 Nov 2005
Posts: 183
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If there is three features/qualities really missing to gothic 2+NOTR in order to make it friendly to most, it's:
1 - A really well made manual. With full contents in any language version. With all shortcuts like this dam unmorph shortcut or the sell all shortcuts and many other. With spells descriptions. With at least a sample list of some weapons and so on.
2 - Settings including all shortcuts with ingame explanations.
3 - A tutorial integrated at the begining of the game, mainly about fights and also about interactivites. |
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Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:59 pm |
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TheMadGamer
High Emperor
Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 487
Location: Southern California |
I played G2 back when it was originally released in the U.S. a couple of years ago. I'm replayiing it now with the NOTR add-on that was recently (finally) released in the U.S. back in November 2005.
Once again, I'm stunned by the shear amount of detail in the game. Previously, someone wrote that G2 is a 'diamond in the rough' but it is far better than that. It is actually a finally cut diamond... but like most diamonds, it does have a few flaws.
However, to highlight the flaws is to happily ignore the big pink elephant in the room, so to speak, of gaming goodness. Unfortunatley, the internet gaming press make their living primarily expressing overly cynical reviews of games they have grossly under-played - especially when it comes to CRPGS. Note To Self: Remember to create a website that reviews game reviews (and reviewers) before dying.
Is the Gothic series perfect? Nope. No game is though. Did the developers succeed as CRPG gamers making a game for CRPG gamers? Yup - and they have succeeded with this in both Gothic 1 and 2 to an outstanding level. And like the folks that made Baldur's Gate 1 & 2 a remarkable success - the developers cranked out a game that no 'self-respecting' publisher would dare touch - a CRPG with an astounding amount of attention and detail to apsects of gameplay not seen since Ultima 7. Folks like EA run from this kind of thing - at least until it becomes a smash hit - then they buy the rights of the series and turn it into Mario Party 98 - RIP my beloved Ultima & Lands of Lore series 
But back to the point of the OP... Internet gaming reviews are a blessing and a curse... but mostly I have found... a curse. Because of the nature of the internet-gaming-reviewing-industry, they pay vs. level of attention to a single game is grossly out of whack. So what you end up with are reviews of CRPGS (which by default are usually quite lengthy games) where the reveiewer spent a few hours with the game. I actually read one review of Morrowind where the reviewer clearly never even played the game - they made so many 'factual' statements that were just plain wrong.
So, if you're going to use the net for review material - and let's face it, we all do (it's freeeeeee afterall), you need to be sure to read a lot of them if you want any hope of getting an accurate perception of the game without actually playing it. Print mags are a little better. Emphsasis on 'little.'
I believe that if G3 holds true to its roots, we will witness the Gothic series transition from a criticical-only success to what will most likely be a critical + financial success. That could be both good or bad for future iterations of the series. Only time will reveal the outcome.
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The Poster Previously Known As NeptiOfPovar
Last edited by TheMadGamer on Sun Feb 12, 2006 4:46 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Sun Feb 12, 2006 4:16 am |
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bjon045
Fearless Paladin
Joined: 02 Jun 2003
Posts: 234
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quote:
Originally posted by Sem
You're forgetting that most gamers aren't hardcore either. The people that bring in the money will throw Gothic 2 Gold away, because they find it to hard.
Are aware the BG series sold over 5 million copies? Isn't that an example of the "hardcore" bringing in the money? |
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Sun Feb 12, 2006 4:34 am |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
quote:
Originally posted by bjon045
Are aware the BG series sold over 5 million copies? Isn't that an example of the "hardcore" bringing in the money?
No its not. Baldurs gate had a very wide appeal due to its media coverage. It sold many copies to people who wouldn't usualy buy, or hadn't previously bought RPG's.
There are not that many Hardcore gamers around nowadays. Definately far less than 5 Million.
Baldurs gate's success was because of marketing media coverage, which by no coincidence was exactly the reason for Gothic's "failure".
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Mon Feb 13, 2006 1:11 pm |
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TheMadGamer
High Emperor
Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 487
Location: Southern California |
quote:
Originally posted by Chekote
Baldurs gate had a very wide appeal due to its media coverage. It sold many copies to people who wouldn't usualy buy, or hadn't previously bought RPG's.
I disagree. For example, no matter how much a product such as, say, a chi-pet is marketed, hyped, and emblazzened onto my eyeballs... I'm just never going to buy one.
Hind sight of the whole Baldur's Gate era of gaming proves that hardcore CRPGing isn't as 'niched' as it is commonly thought to be.
There still aren't a whole lot of hardcore CRPGs not because there isn't a sizeable demographic, but because publishers are more interested in fast turn-around products - of which hardcore CRPGs don't really fit.
quote:
Originally posted by Chekote
There are not that many Hardcore gamers around nowadays. Definately far less than 5 Million.
How do you know this? Where does that number come from?
There are nearly 6 billion people in the world. If even .01% of them enjoy hardcore CRPGs, that would equal to a potential market of 60 million players. Cut that in half, that's still 30 million playeres - far higher than your number of just 5 million.
quote:
Baldurs gate's success was because of marketing media coverage, which by no coincidence was exactly the reason for Gothic's "failure".
No doubt that the marketing certainly helped to notify people everywhere that the game existed. And I do agree that lack of marketing for the Gothic games is a large reason for its lack of financial success... Here in CA I didn't even become aware of Gothic until about a year after its release in the U.S... and then when I became aware of it (Thanks RPGDot!) it was hard to find...
However, Gothics' critical success is creating it's own marketing. That and imiproved marketing for G3 will hopefully transform this series into a Financial
success.
EDIT:
After writing this post I checked http://www.netlingo.com/more/poptick.html and there are now actually 6.6 billion people... so adjust math accordingly.
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The Poster Previously Known As NeptiOfPovar |
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Mon Feb 13, 2006 4:51 pm |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
quote:
Originally posted by TheMadGamer
I disagree. For example, no matter how much a product such as, say, a chi-pet is marketed, hyped, and emblazzened onto my eyeballs... I'm just never going to buy one.
That's true. But I'm not saying that the marketing alone is what is required. But I think most people here will agree that BG and Gothic are both good games (for different reasons). So the marketing tips the balance.
quote:
Originally posted by TheMadGamer
Hind sight of the whole Baldur's Gate era of gaming proves that hardcore CRPGing isn't as 'niched' as it is commonly thought to be.
I don't think so at all. CRPGing is definately very niched. I don't have any links or proof I can give you, just my experiences in everyday life. I see RPG's as a tiny (and mostly ignored) part of the gaming industry, which makes me sad.
quote:
Originally posted by TheMadGamer
How do you know this? Where does that number come from?
There are nearly 6 billion people in the world. If even .01% of them enjoy hardcore CRPGs, that would equal to a potential market of 60 million players. Cut that in half, that's still 30 million playeres - far higher than your number of just 5 million.
I got the 5 million from the previous post. It's not my number.
I don't really think you can get a good estimate of hardcore RPG gamers from the population of the planet because:
1. Gothic and Baldurs Gate are both PC Games, which is mostly only popular in western countries.
2. A huge part of the world's population lives in poverty and cares more about where their next meal comes from and knows nothing of computers, let alone RPGs.
3. *If* you could get a number of actual gamers (Hardcore or otherwise) I would be surprised if 10% of them could be considered "hardcore RPGers".
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Mon Feb 13, 2006 5:52 pm |
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Ratavuk
Noble Knight
Joined: 08 May 2005
Posts: 213
Location: I-Net |
quote:
Originally posted by horst wessel
I found Vampire the Bloodlines controls and interface far worse, than G2. But it only took me an hour to get use to... No, I never even thought G2 had any problems with interface. The only problem with that game is the fact that it has an end.
sorry a little bit off topic but...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horst_Wessel    |
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Mon Feb 13, 2006 8:47 pm |
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TheMadGamer
High Emperor
Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 487
Location: Southern California |
quote:
Originally posted by Chekote
I don't think so at all. CRPGing is definately very niched. I don't have any links or proof I can give you, just my experiences in everyday life. I see RPG's as a tiny (and mostly ignored) part of the gaming industry, which makes me sad.
I think I'm beginning to understand you. There is a slight difference in what you are saying and what I thought you were saying.
Yes, I agree that based on the number of titles, the CRPG market is small relative to other generes. And like you, it makes me sad too
However, I find it interesting that through all the years the CRPG genere continues to survive.
My take on this is that whenever a CRPG is done really well, it does become a huge financial success (given proper marketing). Modern case in points: Baldur's Gate 1 & 2, NWN, Morrowind. It becomes a huge financial success because there are a lot of people willing to buy them.
So then the question is, why so few CRPG titles relative to other generes. My take on that is that the big publishers just don't want to spend the time and money on these types of games when they can crank out FPS 2983, 2984, and 2985 in the same amount of time it would take to make one Baldur's Gate quality CRPG.
I think that as consoles transform more and more into mini-PCs and if/when the Windows platform can further make the game-developing process easier for Windows game developers, that CRPGs could actually flourish and rivial generes such as FPS and RTS.
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The Poster Previously Known As NeptiOfPovar |
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Mon Feb 13, 2006 10:17 pm |
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