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Jaz
Late Night Spook
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 9708
Location: RPGDot |
Thanks for the preview  . I liked what I read. Fable didn't reach our store yet, but I'll take one copy off the shelf as soon as it's here...
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Jaz |
Fri Sep 17, 2004 7:40 am |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
quote:
Originally posted by DarthOtzzelot
Players expecting too much is one thing, developers praising features in interviews that are not in the game is another.
I can see how you would think that.
Peter has a habit of talking about things he wants to implement before he knows if they will work or not. A lot of the people who he does interviews with dont understand this and claim that they are guaranteed features of the game.
I personaly have no problem. Peter's games never have all the features that he wants to implement, but they are all very good games. I personaly would rather have him reach for unatainable goals than put out the same crap that almost everyone else does...
Some of my best gaming memories have been from Peters games.
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Fri Sep 17, 2004 3:24 pm |
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Jabberwocky
Noble Knight
Joined: 06 Nov 2003
Posts: 208
Location: New York, USA |
Okay, I’m back after a slight delay in getting Fable, and although I haven’t spent much time with it, (because I can't pry the controller from my roomate's fingertips),j I have a few comments to make.
Chekote is right, the game is slightly reminiscent of Baldur’s Gate. In what ways? Here’s what I’ve noticed:
1. NPC’s have colorful personalities and are voice acted well.
2. There aren’t really dialogue options, rather, choices to select and the NPC responds accordingly.
3. Quests are obtained similarly, in that you simply find the appropriately identified person(s), in this case color-coded. This eliminates any detective work involved in finding stuff to do. You also get multiple quests from the same location (Hero’s Guild) and therefore is less progression in dealing with new characters and traveling to new places. (You can “recall” right back to the Hero’s Guild, just like recalling back to Baldur’s Gate in, well... Baldur’s Gate.)
4. Pieces of armor can be equipped in individual sections, and different styles can be worn simultaneously.
5. Weapons can be upgraded.
6. World is not completely free roaming. While it is more-so than BG, you can’t simply go anywhere you wish.
There are some similarities to the Gothic games as well, but most are less evident:
1. 3rd person movement and combat in 3-D world.
2. Lots of NPC’s to deal with. Everywhere you go there are people - traders outside the towns to deal with and/or protect. A ton of people inside the towns.
3. Loads of monsters, creatures, and bandits to fight and kill.
4. Emphasis placed on cool looking and deadly weapons. Weapons are shown on the body and can be equipped or unequipped.
5. Inventory is limitless.
Fable is not the “mother-of-all RPG’s” as Peter Molyneux would have you believe. It is definitely a step in the right direction, but does have some adolescent hickups. Nevertheless, it is a very well made game that should bring you hours of entertainment. I personally still have to favor Gothic 2 over Fable at this point in time. Whether that changes or not remains to be seen.
Some things I like about Fable is that it oozes over with character. Although I haven’t found any NPC that is as memorable as some in the Gothic series, they are quite fun to watch perform. The various British accents performed for true-to-life scenarios make it feel at times as if you momentarily stepped into an episode of “Monty Python’s Flying Circus” or “Keeping up Appearances.” Listening to a woman chew out her cheating husband that you helped to discover is bound to make anyone laugh. “I ought to cut them off! My mother was right about you!” she says. 
The graphics are incredibly gorgeous. Everything moves, from twigs to weeds to your own hair. Seeing the real-time shadows of leaves on the ground from a tree overhead is almost something to write home about. Character appearances have a distinctive Black & White look, naturally. There is also a hint of Japanese Manga thrown in as well, with gargantuan belt buckles, humongous boots, and gloves that could double as backpacks. A great deal of effort was put into making the ambience very luminescent during the day. This is good and bad. Occasionally some areas were so bright that they seemed washed-out. Of course I’m wondering how all this would run on an average PC should the game be released for such, but one comfort is that the view distance is usually fairly limited due to the confines of the world design. Again, this is also a good and bad thing. The same thing that would make your processor happy is the same thing that makes free-roaming Gothic fans angry - you can’t go just anywhere you please.
A fault (in my book) that I discovered within 30 seconds of gameplay is that you have no ability to jump. It makes me feel like I don’t really have complete control of a character when I can’t make him do things that are inherent to human capability, such as jumping. I felt that this also further emphasized the limits of the navigable areas of the world. You can’t go up to a fence or a rock and see what’s on the other side, and you can’t utilize the strategy of climbing up onto something to stay out of reach of your opponent while shooting him with your ranged weapon (a tactic almost vital to early success in the Gothic games). They made up for this lack of movement by offering another move in combat that Gothic does not. Besides the standard hack/slash and blocking capabilities, you can also do a Prince of Persia style “roll around behind your opponent and out of harm’s way” defensive move; something I found to be quite useful more than once.
The camera controls are almost identical to Beyond Good & Evil, but there are more options than there are buttons on the controller. You need those options, especially when facing multiple enemies, yet the difficulty is found in finding them with your fingers rather than the skill of your opponents. I think a PC version of this game would really put it in it’s element, however. As with all RPG’s, inventory navigation and executing multiple options would be much simpler on a computer keyboard.
The world is rich with NPC’s and interactive things, although no where near the level as Gothic is, in which you can’t venture five feet without stopping to bend over and pick up something to line your bottomless pockets. One particularly fun “interaction,” however, is going up to a chicken and kicking it across the road like a football, a cloud of feathers exploding in the process! Another interactive thing that Fable sports is the ability to behead someone, and then wield their head as a trophy, or kick it like you did the chicken if that’s what you’re into. Even with this gruesome inclusion, the mood of the game is noticeably lighter than the dark and somber Gothic. The designers intentionally created humorous scenarios and dialogue, whereas the humor derived from Gothic is many times the result of programming anomalies. Make no mistake, however; there are spooky moments as well in Fable. These are further impressed by a fantastic musical score. Reportedly only the main theme was written by the famed composer Danny Elfman, but the in-game music is top-notch too. You can really hear how much better a soundtrack is when recorded from live orchestra rather than a synthesizer. Let’s hope that Kairo and the rest of PB’s opt for live recording for Gothic 3.
Now for a word about the elements of Fable that were famed to be so revolutionary. Some of them are awesome, and lived up to my expectations in every way. How cool is it to choose your own hairstyle, and this isn’t even a Barbie video game! We wouldn’t have to worry about debates on the hero’s pony tail if something like this was implemented into Gothic, would we? On the other hand, some things that sounded great when Molyneux talked them up, are not so well executed on screen. For instance, it’s great to feel that the world notices your antics - calling you “Chicken chaser” after you’ve kicked a few hens around. After a fortnight passes, however, and you haven’t touched a chicken, but every other NPC is still calling you that, it gets pretty darn annoying, and doesn’t feel realistic at all. Some sort of balance needs to be struck in future games that head in this direction. Another disappointment is the lack of simply being able to give a companion a healing potion if he/she needs one. Molyneux bragged and bragged about how you can woo people with gifts, etc... and yet your buddy dies and you have to start a quest over because you couldn’t give him a health potion. I mean, that’s pretty basic in modern RPGs, isn’t it? Something else in which Gothic still excels at is NPC scripting. Although the people in Fable act a little more complex than, say, the ole Morrowind “Walk ten paces... stand in place 15 seconds....walk back,” they come no where near to touching the detail that was delivered in Gothic. This praise on Gothic may be negated though with the development of Gothic 3. As most of you probably saw, the NPC routines will not be as detailed due to the large size of the game.
Probably the one thing that annoys the living daylights out of me with Fable is the “mentor’s voice” that follows you around everywhere you go, providing you with useless information and making you wonder how the heck this person is in your head. I repeatedly found myself shouting things like “I know my health is low, there’s a health bar right on the screen you frickin’ moron!” You may be right in the middle of nail-biting combat upon hearing “There’s an important quest card waiting for you at the Hero’s Guild!” This may not be as much of a nuisance for others, but if I ever meet the Lionhead designer responsible for sticking Obi-wan in the game, I’ll threaten to wave my private parts at his aunties, or at the very least, fart in his general direction! 
Not to end on a negative however, let me recap the pluses: Gorgeous world and character design, novel ideas (did I mention the on-screen time of day/night indicator?), entertaining humor, and beautiful music. All in all I’d say this game accomplished as much (or more) in art as it did technical merit. Bottom line is, don’t buy an X-Box just to have this game. Wait for it to be released to PC; if that happens it’ll be a better game anyhow. If you do own an X-Box, and love RPGs, you would be a fool not to go out and buy the game right now if you have not already done so.
I know there are 1,500 reviews for Fable on-line, I just thought you all might appreciate hearing it from someone you know, so hopefully I’ve provided a little insight for ya. Whatever you decide - Fable, Gothic, or both, one thing is for sure - you are going to have loads of fun! 
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"D'oh! I knew I should've saved sooner!" |
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Sun Sep 19, 2004 1:13 am |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
quote:
Originally posted by Jabberwocky
For instance, it’s great to feel that the world notices your antics - calling you “Chicken chaser” after you’ve kicked a few hens around. After a fortnight passes, however, and you haven’t touched a chicken, but every other NPC is still calling you that, it gets pretty darn annoying, and doesn’t feel realistic at all.
Chicken chaser is your default Hero name. I had the same title and I had never even seen a Chicken when people were calling me it. The guy outside the Hero's Guild sells new title. I am now "PieMaster". Fear me!
quote:
Originally posted by Jabberwocky
Probably the one thing that annoys the living daylights out of me with Fable is the “mentor’s voice” that follows you around everywhere you go, providing you with useless information and making you wonder how the heck this person is in your head.
The mentor can speak to you using the Guild Amulet that you carry. He did tell you that when he gave it to you . But yes, I agree that is is very aggrivating.
quote:
Originally posted by Jabberwocky
Bottom line is, don’t buy an X-Box just to have this game. Wait for it to be released to PC; if that happens it’ll be a better game anyhow. If you do own an X-Box, and love RPGs, you would be a fool not to go out and buy the game right now if you have not already done so.
I dont agree at all. I did buy an XBox just for fable, and now after playing it for quite some time I am 100% glad that I did. It is easily my best RPG since Gothic 2. Its kind of like a cross between Zelda and Gothic, which happen to be my two best Action RPG's. If you love Action RPG's, with lots of scope for character development ala Baldurs Gate; then you have to get this game, even if it means buying an XBox.
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:44 am |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
Well after playing Fable all weekend long I have no idea what these reviewers are complaining about. I still havent finished the game and I have probably been playing it for 15+ hours. I thought they said you could finish it quickly?
Its obvious to me that anyone who says that is just rushing through the game and missing 95% of the point/content.
I have probably been to most of the world map now, but I have only opened 3 of the demon doors (I think I have found about 10 so far). Also I cant find hardly any of the damn silver keys (Which you need to open certain chests), and I have estimated I probably need at least 40 so far.
I have bought 2 houses and upgraded both of them to full capacity. But there are a LOT more that I can buy. Also there are some very cool weapons and armor that I still cant find/afford.
It seems to me that even when I do finish the main storyline I will still have plent to keep me occupied. Not counting the fact that I have been playing a non-magic using goody goody all the way through and intend to play the game through again with at least 2 other character types.
Needless to say I am very impressed with the game, and anyone who doesnt like it either doesnt like Action RPG's, has hyped the game up too much, or just hasnt given it a chance.
P.S. The undead are freaking awesome, by far the coolest undead I have seen in a game 
P.P.S. Anyone who is having problem with the targetting causing you to hit innocents: You dont have to use the targetting when fighting. In fact I find that its a lot better when you dont because you can throw blows behind and in front off you as and when you need. The targetting is only realy useful when you are fighting one-on-one or when you WANT to attack an innocent. If you dont use the targetting then its impossible to hurt an innocent, even if your sword hits them. (I dont think that counts for arrows or area effect spells though).
Fable Fanboy out...
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Mon Sep 20, 2004 1:53 pm |
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Rubix³
Head Merchant
Joined: 30 May 2004
Posts: 62
Location: Chicago - USA |
Thank you for your thought-out and intelligent critiques. Keep them coming.
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Funny how? |
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Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:20 pm |
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noah
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 31 Dec 2001
Posts: 35
Location: MD |
I'm pretty sure I recognize some of the voice actors in Fable as ones that acted in Gothic I and II.
Fable was the sole reason I bought an XBox and has (so far) been the only game I've really played on it since I've had the system about a year now. I never was a huge KOTOR fan, (I played the PC version) but I definitely think Fable is more fun. Whether or not it's a better game...tough to say. The Gothic series definitely ranks higher in my book though, as it's world simulation, scope, atmosphere and general depth are oh-so smarter, bigger and richer. Fable, for what it is though, is very fun...and this is coming from a *die hard* single-player PC gamer.
Although Fable is a far cry from what was promised/touted by BBB and Molyneux during the Project Ego era, I am finding the game to be quite enjoyable.
The environments, while extremely linear and small, are quite lush and atmospheric. The hero customization through play activity is quite fun and is a huge part of the enjoyment IMO. The dialogue (though not detailed/rich in the Gothic/Bioware/Ultima VII/VIII sense) is quite humorous and well written / acted - what little of it there is. The story so far is nothing to write home about, but in all honestly RPG stories, for me, are usually just an excuse to play the game, and not anything I ever get worked up over and care about, or even pay much attention to. In most cases they're not a motivating factor (with rare exceptions of course - i.e. Planescape) so please take my reaction to story with a grain of salt.
The sound effects and music are top notch and I think the audio is my favorite aspect of the game. I'm a big ear candy junkie and my favor for games can be heavily skewed by how good the music is - it just puts me that much more in to the game. (Daggerfall, Gothic, Thief, Monkey Island, Ultima, Fallout)
Combat, though definitely arcade/console based is quite fun, once you get the hang of it. After getting some good stats, and a decent weapon, one really begins to feel like an incredible warrior - especially once the flourishes (combos) start to flow and add up. This is further enhanced by other bystanders that might happen to be standing by, egging you on. The targeting can indeed be frustrating at times, but after getting used to it's kinks, and when and where to use it, combat is fast paced and at times, graceful. This is indeed coming from a person who generally despises fast-paced, twitch, console combat.
My biggest gripes with the game so far are that it's fairly short, the extremely linear, sectioned environments and the occasional poor feature implementation approach. (For example, it only rains in designated areas and the time of day isn't retained in a save - little annoying things that make the world feel less believable and more, well, game-like.)
Finally, I am just not a fan of the console save mentality. The XBox is indeed bringing things closer to the PC level, but console games in general have a long way to go in this area. The frightening thing is that many PC titles recently have begun to adopt the console/save point mentality. I know these are much more stable/simpler/cleaner to implement from a tech. standpoint, but finer save control is much less frustrating. I say, let us save when we want, wherever we want, and retain everything!
All and all, I'm enjoying Fable quite a bit and it is the first console game in a LOOONG time that I've really enjoyed playing. (Since perhaps Zelda III for the SNES and maybe Ocarina of Time - I will never touch a Final Fantasy game as long as I live, if I can help it. *shudder* Or at least until they seriously re-invent the franchise.) Again, I'm not a console gamer by any stretch of the imagination but I've always been intrigued by what Project Ego promised, and it in many ways, had features that I wanted in a PC game. Sadly, Fable is not at all Project Ego, if you take my meaning. However, I can say with confidence that I've forgotten much of that mentality as I've been playing and I am really enjoying the game for what it is. |
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Mon Sep 20, 2004 7:38 pm |
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Tomha
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 33
Location: florida |
Its good like gothic, you can be what you wish. good, evil or nuetral. and its so cool. but I like G2 more. 
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Tue Sep 21, 2004 1:00 am |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
If it wasnt chopped into small areas, and had some of the faction motif of Gothic then it would be very similar.
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Wed Sep 22, 2004 9:55 pm |
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