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JensJeremy
Village Dweller
Joined: 10 Dec 2003
Posts: 12
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| Please Help a Newbie--Bows, or Swords? |
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I can't decide whether to go bows or swords. Bows sound good in theory, and the dexterity would be useful in picking locks, sneaking and picking pockets, but... bows seem to have a few drawbacks. Firing into a pack brings the entire pack after you instantly; bows kill, there is no "knockdown"; bows can run out of ammunition; you cannot parry with a bow; it also seems to me that unless you have at least 60 in bows, you won't hit anything far away (if at all).
The reason I ask, is because I read such good things about bows in here, how powerful they are, and how dragons are so hard to kill with swords. *shrug* I am at a loss. I am saved right outside Onar's farm right now. I have 30 in 1-handed swords, sneaking, lockpicking, furs and shadow beast horns. That's 40 points spent so far, and nothing else. I have 40 more unspent points as well. I would like to join the mercenaries, but Sentenza is a punk, and so is Bullco or however you spell that. What is the best? If I take bows, I won't be able to brawl without killing!
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"We're a dream team!" --Mud |
Sat Mar 11, 2006 7:31 pm |
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Warmskin
Keeper of the Gates
Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 116
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Well, many here will tell you to specialize in one or the other, but I'm not of that persuasion. I use a 2H sword (started off with 1H, but switched to 2H about a third of the way thru the game) *and* I also use the Crossbow (don't care for bows). Crossbows use strength as well as dexterity so the STR that you pour into 1H sword training also pays off as you become able to equip better and better crossbows thoughout the game.
***** Spoilers ahead *****
And the DEX will help you as well. If you stick with 1H (which is a perfectly fine choice - I switched basically just to try something new), soon (if you haven't found it already) a good sword will become available which needs a good DEX score as well as STR to equip). Later in the game, many enemies which you now consider really tough will go down pretty easily with a good crossbow. And much later a really kicka$$ crossbow becomes available (along with excellent 1H and 2H swords). So, what I'm saying is you can have both (= more fun). BUT, here comes the IMPORTANT note: Be very careful with your use of LPs. The cost breaks on LPs come at 30, 60, 90 and 120, I believe. Try to train as high as you can naturally (by that I mean with a trainer) and try to refrain from using potions, tablets, etc. until later. If you need just a little to get you that use of a better sword or crossbow it's OK, but try to save them until later when the price of a trainer skyrockets and you really don't want to pay huge amounts of LPs for just a small increase in skill. There are a couple good FAQs here and at Gamefaqs.com that will explain all this. Just remember that FAQs based on the vanilla G2 will not have the update on how LPs are now applied in NotR. I am nearing completion pretty soon, and I'm doing very well with this combo (some monsters go down easier with a *different* weapon. I am playing a Paladin, but I think it's pretty similar. If someone else is playing a Merc and thinks this logic wouldn't apply then perhaps this would be a good time for him (or her) to speak up. Good luck. |
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Sat Mar 11, 2006 10:08 pm |
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JensJeremy
Village Dweller
Joined: 10 Dec 2003
Posts: 12
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I should have stated that I don't have the expansion pack (yet). For whatever reason, I have gotten far into Gothic II several times but have never managed to finish the game. Always something comes up. Death in the family, moving, hard drive gets wiped, it never ends. Once again I want to attempt beating Gothic II. From what I've read about the Raven expansion, it sounds a little sadistic to me. Why the severe changes in LP costs? I have to finish this version before trudging off to finish the much harder one, I think.
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"We're a dream team!" --Mud |
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Sun Mar 12, 2006 7:23 am |
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Warmskin
Keeper of the Gates
Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 116
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Well, if you're not too far into the game then I suggest you restart and this time install the expansion. Now, that is just a *suggestion*, so take it for what it's worth. But unless you're really into playing the same game (virtually) over again then you might want to think about it. NotR is woven seamlessly into the fabric of G2. You get the *whole* package by playing G2 with NotR. It's not really that tough (but, it is challenging).  I play as a Paladin, so YMMV.
Either way though, I'm sure you'll have fun...
Last edited by Warmskin on Wed Mar 15, 2006 12:28 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Sun Mar 12, 2006 10:34 pm |
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Uriziel
Grand Mage
Joined: 17 May 2002
Posts: 735
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Since you are playing G2 without NOTR, I'd suggest going for ranged weapons. The stronger crossbows make the game rather simple to beat. If you really want to go for overkill, create a battle mage. Powerful magic and a kickass crossbow makes you unstoppable.....plus you'll be able to use the dex based swords 
Warning: Playing as a battle mage will make you think you are ten feet tall and bullet proof, and in the game you will be........but don't carry that attitude into real life 
_________________
Chris: Dad, what's the blow-hole for?
Peter: I'll tell you what it's not for, son. And when I do, you'll understand why I can never go back to Sea World. |
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Sun Mar 12, 2006 10:57 pm |
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JensJeremy
Village Dweller
Joined: 10 Dec 2003
Posts: 12
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Too late now, I guess. I would install the expansion, if I had it. No chance to go out today to buy it, either. Not until Wednesday. But I do have a few questions, so when I play through again I'll do it right. Do DEX-based swords (like the rapier) actually apply your DEX as a bonus to damage on critical hits? They don't seem to. How can you be a battle mage? Is there even enough XP in the game to have bows AND magic? Especially in Night of the Raven. If everything costs more after 30, then doubles, then triples in LP costs... I don't see how you could even get past 60. There's too many things you need to learn. Nobody said whether or not you have to train both weapon types at the same time anymore (you know, when you get to 30 in 1-handed, you have to also train 2-handed to 30, then 1-handed to 60, etc.). If that rule is still in NotR, then I REALLY don't think I could stand also paying double then triple the learning points. That is insane.
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"We're a dream team!" --Mud |
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Mon Mar 13, 2006 12:33 pm |
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Uriziel
Grand Mage
Joined: 17 May 2002
Posts: 735
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Don't even think about battle mage in NOTR. You need to know the game inside and out to do battle mage in Notr....and it is still tough.
For a battle mage in G2 forget strength, up your dex to 50 as quick as possible, get a good dex based sword and a little later after upping dex some more, get a decent crossbow. Well before you become a mage and start learning circles you'll have a nice dex sword and crossbow. Then you can easily clear out tough areas to up your LP's.....save them to learn circles Try to have enough saved to learn the first 3 circles. After learning Circle 3 you have a little latitude on how you spend LP's, but remember to save some to learn the next circle. Also since you are raising dex, you'll be able to lockpick and pickpoccket much better.
Don't bother learning any of the circle 1 or 2 runes. Try to get ice block, then it is a very easy game from there. If you have a few extra LP's, learn ball lightning or lightning. They are decent circle 3 runes, but are'nt neccessary. Later in the game learn Army of Darkness....it will be your bestest friend. Also learn Wave of Death and Rain of Fire. Remember to save these rare scrolls to make the runes.
Draw out creatures/enemies one at a time, ice block, and cut them up with your sword. Using this method you can kill very strong mobs without bleeding profusely. In fact you can easily clear any map and gets tons of exp.
_________________
Chris: Dad, what's the blow-hole for?
Peter: I'll tell you what it's not for, son. And when I do, you'll understand why I can never go back to Sea World. |
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Mon Mar 13, 2006 11:38 pm |
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Warmskin
Keeper of the Gates
Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 116
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quote:
Originally posted by JensJeremy
Too late now, I guess. I would install the expansion, if I had it. No chance to go out today to buy it, either. Not until Wednesday. But I do have a few questions, so when I play through again I'll do it right. Do DEX-based swords (like the rapier) actually apply your DEX as a bonus to damage on critical hits? They don't seem to. How can you be a battle mage? Is there even enough XP in the game to have bows AND magic? Especially in Night of the Raven. If everything costs more after 30, then doubles, then triples in LP costs... I don't see how you could even get past 60. There's too many things you need to learn. Nobody said whether or not you have to train both weapon types at the same time anymore (you know, when you get to 30 in 1-handed, you have to also train 2-handed to 30, then 1-handed to 60, etc.). If that rule is still in NotR, then I REALLY don't think I could stand also paying double then triple the learning points. That is insane.
Don't let your fear of NotR stop you from eventually playing that game. You'll be missing one of the best RPGs ever made (IMHO). It is *not* as hard as you think. There are other ways to increase LPs. I don't want to say anymore and spoil anything for you, but take my word when I say: Don't miss out on NotR. |
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Tue Mar 14, 2006 2:43 am |
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JensJeremy
Village Dweller
Joined: 10 Dec 2003
Posts: 12
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Huh . . . this is the spoiler forum, you can spoil me. I certainly don't want to go into NotR unprepared. There is only one FAQ for it on gamefaqs.com, but I can't figure what to do with the info there, it's not enough.
The whole magic thing intrigues me lately. I wish I had gone mage this time, but I'm a mercenary and if I quit now I'll never beat Gothic II even once. Funny thing is, I must have beaten Gothic I at least 10 times back in the day when I first got it. Anybody remember that? I'm from the US in case anybody is wondering. I know the German version is probably better. For some reason I got the sneaking suspicion that Gothic II was changed somewhat in the US version. I remember Gothic I being much more gritty, and it even had scantily clad women. One was completely nude if you deleted her bikini skin file. Germany probably isn't uptight about that sort of thing, so I am wondering if anyone from Germany here can tell me what the differences are? I have read that NotR is the un-edited version of Germany's Gothic II. I may have read it in here, or in a review of Night of the Raven on a web site, I can't remember. But I heard it even starts out different. Now, if memory serves correctly, at the end of Gothic I, the nameless hero talks after sending the Sleeper back to his dimension, saying that when he got outside, the barrier had fallen. But at the start of Gothic II, it seems that the nameless hero has died! Why the change? Was it a bad translation? What really happened? And why is Diego's VO not the same as in Gothic I? Just a bunch of silly questions 
But I hope someone writes a more detailed NotR faq for GameFaqs, or one day I might have to do it myself if I ever get it and play it 100 times.
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"We're a dream team!" --Mud |
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Tue Mar 14, 2006 12:46 pm |
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imposteraz
Tempered Warlord
Joined: 25 Jul 2003
Posts: 282
Location: Arizona, USA |
Well JensJeremy, you are full of questions!
First, there's a whole (sticky) thread in the Gothic II Spoilers forum devoted just to what is different between G2 and NotR, so I won't reproduce it here. Lots of good info in there for the curious.
As for the higher LP costs in NotR, don't worry too much. As well as potions that increase your attributes, there are also a new item (stone tablets) that can increase skill levels as well as attributes. Also, you can pray at Innos shrines and get more attribute increases than you could in G2. (I believe in G2 you could only get a total of 20 points, but in NotR you can get as much as 20 EACH of Dex and Strength.) So there are things to help you along the way.
The big thing in NotR is to raise your attributes and skills with LPs early in the game (when they are cheaper) and then use other means as much as possible later in the game, and only use LPs when you just need that last point or two so you can use that new weapon, etc.
If you like G1 and G2 at all, I'm sure you'll get a real kick out of NotR!
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imposterAZ
"OK, I've got the 'No Die' part." |
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Tue Mar 14, 2006 4:02 pm |
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JensJeremy
Village Dweller
Joined: 10 Dec 2003
Posts: 12
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Hm, so are you saying that training strength and dexterity also doubles after 30 and triples after 60? That . . . sounds a bit harsh. But can anyone answer me this? Do you still have to train each counterpart, like 1-handed and 2-handed, with a 30 point gap?
And I have to ask . . . what is the best way to build a mage? I still have yet to play one in G2, the vanilla version. I think it's impossible not to train melee. The game forces you to duel too many people, and if you don't use melee weapons you'll end up killing them when you shouldn't. And 10% in 1-handed isn't going to win a fight with Bullco or Sentenza. So could you train up to 30% in everything and then use tablets to get to 60% in everything?
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"We're a dream team!" --Mud |
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Wed Mar 15, 2006 4:32 am |
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imposteraz
Tempered Warlord
Joined: 25 Jul 2003
Posts: 282
Location: Arizona, USA |
Yes, it is a bit harsh. When you get way up there, it can cost you 5 LPs per point of attribute or skill. That's why you should spend LPs up front, when it's cheap, and use other methods (as much as possible) later on.
You do have to train both one and two handed weapons at the same time, but I found that in NotR it's not really a problem as you will find enough tablets to keep your least favorite skill from falling too far behind. I actually had more problem with the dual training issue in vanilla G2.
My preferred way to build a Mage (in both G2 and NotR) is to concentrate on Mana and runes, but also train up your Dex. Then use a bow and a Dex-use sword as backups. The sword can be used to finish off those you don't want to kill -- just soften them up with spells and/or your bow first.
For a Mage, training up to 30% with LPs and then using tablets for the rest is a good strategy, IMO.
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imposterAZ
"OK, I've got the 'No Die' part." |
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Wed Mar 15, 2006 7:22 am |
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JensJeremy
Village Dweller
Joined: 10 Dec 2003
Posts: 12
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Imposteraz, so for a mage, should I train Dex to . . . 50? And both bows and crossbows to 30? See that's my problem. Even if I knew what to train in, I wouldn't know how far to train them to. And on top of that, 1-handed to 30? I like the whole Dex idea because I like to steal things   Unfortunately dex based swords don't seem to use your dexterity as a damage bonus for critical hits. But from all I've read, once you have ice block, it's all smooth sailing from then on. But you have to get to chapter 3 for that, right? Yikes... damn orcs in the valley of mines will make short work of me.
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"We're a dream team!" --Mud |
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Wed Mar 15, 2006 1:57 pm |
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imposteraz
Tempered Warlord
Joined: 25 Jul 2003
Posts: 282
Location: Arizona, USA |
Yes, if you can get your Dex to at least 50 and one hand sword to 30+ then you will be able to use the Rapier fairly well and use a decent bow.
Like you said, Ice Block changes everything for a Mage. You'll find that you will need to use scrolls a lot more in NotR than in vanilla G2, until you get to Ch 3 at least. Fortunately, there are more scrolls of various types available in NotR, and powerful ones are available sooner, too.
It's definitely harder in the beginning, but by the end Mages rule!
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imposterAZ
"OK, I've got the 'No Die' part." |
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Wed Mar 15, 2006 3:52 pm |
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Uriziel
Grand Mage
Joined: 17 May 2002
Posts: 735
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quote:
Originally posted by JensJeremy
Yikes... damn orcs in the valley of mines will make short work of me.
Who said you have to kill the orcs?? You can always come back and take them out later. Your first trip to the VoM is simply to get info about the dragons.....so get the dang info and get out alive. And THEN what chapter are you in....HMMM??? You should be in chapter 3, so you'll be able to get decent runes....ice block being the most important.
Your first trip to VoM you only need to be able to kill snappers. That is the ONLY requirement to complete your quest. Of course you will want to take out as many of the lesser creatures as you can for the exp., but facing an orc or lizardman ain't wise at that point in the game. One word.....RUN!!!!! Ya might want to bring along a shrink monster scroll to take out the Troll, but snappers should be the strongest opponent you should face.
_________________
Chris: Dad, what's the blow-hole for?
Peter: I'll tell you what it's not for, son. And when I do, you'll understand why I can never go back to Sea World. |
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Thu Mar 16, 2006 8:10 am |
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