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Z-lot
Village Dweller
Joined: 06 Jul 2003
Posts: 23
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Well, I hope my opinion won't hurt...
Der_Schnitter_t (and others):
French was international (diplomatic) language from times of Luis XIV. to first world war.
Indogermanic languages? There is no such thing. Indo-European languages maybe? And Europe doesn't belong to german ancestors. If we look at it from that point, it belongs to Venets, who were the first all-European nation long before anyone else stepped on this ground.
English languages has a history that is pretty different than history of French or German language. Constant migrations and mixture of nations gave English language good foundations for future and therefore, it always transformed to something simpler. And that is, I think, a good matter. That makes English the best language for communicating - easy to learn, understand and also flexible. But that doesn't make it more or less worthy than any other language on Earth - not Chinese (with its numerous dialects), Indian (Indian language doesn't exist, actually - India has 1500 different languages) or any other.
So please, don't talk nonsense if you don't know what does this nonsense mean.
(My native language is not English but Slovene - if someone accidentially knows what language is that. And comparing to English, it is much harder to learn, even harder than German or French - for example: we have dual. )
With all possible respect, Z-lot |
Fri Jul 11, 2003 4:04 pm |
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mythicdude
City Guard
Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 135
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let me tell u something Der_Schnitter_t, even romanians made some FPS game, BUT i didn't found any version in my language, and why do u think that? I THINK that they don't need to work for the game again to translate it, the time used to translate it could be used to fix bugs, or something.
i also saw a few games, a few but there are, when u entered the setup u could choose your own language(ENGLISH, french, spanish), so why couldn't gothic be that way? they made in german and took 6 months to translate into english (that's why thay made in german first, because they didn't knew english at all...). i told u above that the romanians made a FPS , well they made it directly into english, because they knew english very well and didn't need to hire translators  and what,pyranha-bytes wanted to know if is having succes in germany, so that is worthing to translate it..  |
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Fri Jul 11, 2003 10:51 pm |
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Mystique
Village Dweller
Joined: 11 Jul 2003
Posts: 4
Location: Alberta |
Hmm I would just like to say that Mandrin is the most widely spoken langue....
But i am new.. and i probably should not stick my nose where it doesn't belong.....
As for German, here in Canada we have both High and Low German so it gets a tad bit confussing |
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 2:23 am |
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Der_Schnitter_t
Captain of the Guard
Joined: 29 Jun 2003
Posts: 178
Location: Germania |
@mythicdude:
First let me tell you something about the games market, Germany as it stands is the country that is number three in games software sales, after USA and Japan. That alone would warrant to program a game here in Germany only for the German market (in German language also, of course), since it would create enough revenue if it sold enough units. Also, the compelxity of an RPG such as Gothic II with over 9 hours of spoken dialog can hardly be compare to the 1 hour max of dialog you get in an FPS and usually the dialog is less. Creating and writing hours of dialog and a story in a language you are not totally familiar with can get tedious at best. Then there is also the possibility that mistakes will be sooner found if that game uses the mother tounge.
As for the games, where you saw that the setup dialog offered different languages, that does not necessarily mean that the game itself will run in that language, most often it is only a choice of language for the setup dialog only and the game will run in the different language.
Another problem, that Piranha Bytes could not do much about, was the finding of an internatinal publisher. It is very important to have a publisher, he is the one that takes care of the distribution of the game in different languages. It might have been possible to have the game available in English in as soon as 1 or 2 months after the inital German release, but without publisher this was not possible. Infogrames (now Atari) only became the Publisher in April. Before that date doing an English translation would have been a risky and costly venture for PB, without knowing if someone would publish it outside the German speaking countries. I also think that PB was very well aware of the fact that Gothic 2 would be sucessful in Germany, they only needed to wait for a Publisher and that was the one that wanted to see sucess. So if anyone is in any way to blame for the long waiting time, then it would be the managers at either Jowood or Atari and not the PB's.
@z-lot:
Why wouldn't there be such a thing as a Germanic language branch? I wonder, English, German, Danish, Norwegian, Swedish and Dutch all share a few very common similarites and those are also the langauages know as the Germanic languages. French, Italian, Spanish and other South-European dialects are know as Latin languages since they use and share a lot of the language the Romans used. There are very distinct differences between the Latin and the Germanic languages. If you as an Englishman for example would see something written in Dutch or Swedish, you still would be able to at least guess what it means, while seeing something in French you would be totally lost. As far as I see it there has been a seperation in the languages in Western Europe, hasn't there?
[/b] |
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 2:28 am |
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Z-lot
Village Dweller
Joined: 06 Jul 2003
Posts: 23
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Der_Schnitter_t:
Of course there is germanic language branch (and for your information: I can speak Danish ...and German too). But you mentioned Indo-Germanic branch... which is incorrect. If your first statement would be true, some non-Indian rooted Germanic language could exist. Well, does it?
And - it is not so hard to understand Flamic language if your primary language isn't on the same branch as Flamic. All you have to know is one of the other on-the-same-branch languages.
That's all. |
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:34 pm |
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Der_Schnitter_t
Captain of the Guard
Joined: 29 Jun 2003
Posts: 178
Location: Germania |
There are Indo-Germanic languages, of which the Germanic languages are part of, so I was not wrong by default. Indo-Germanic languages are divided into 11 groups:
- Albanic
- Anatolic (e.g. Lydic, Lykic)
- Armenic
- baltic languages (e.g. oldprussian)
- germanic languages (e.g. Dutch, Danish, German, Swedish)
- Greek
- Indoiranian languages (e.g. Avestic, Hindi, Sanskrit, Marathi)
- Keltic languages (e.g. Bretonian, Gaelic, Irish)
- Romanic/Italic languages (e.g. Italian, French, Latin, Portugese)
- Slavic languages (e.g. Russian, Slovene, Polish)
- Tocharic
So maybe I was wrong in naming the whole she-bang here by writing Indo-Germanic, instead of just mentioning the sub-branch of Germanic languages thereof, but fact is, Indo-Germanic is the term used to describe these language branches as a whole here in Germany. This is why I used it the first time, though I will take care the next time and only mention the exact branch if need be. |
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Sat Jul 12, 2003 8:06 pm |
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Delo
City Guard
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 125
Location: Center of the Universe |
22 billion? wow. i didnt think there were more than 5 billion on the entire planet....lol
_________________
I don't do autographs. |
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Mon Jul 14, 2003 7:22 pm |
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Egin
Keeper of the Gates
Joined: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 120
Location: Estonia |
Okies you all guys went waay off topic and the funniest part is, that the initiator of this thread is keeping silence. No offence though.
Der Shmidter
Impressive! To be fair, I don't remember about Indo-germanic languages (hmm what languages are not included in this grp?)
But this is probably true, I have to consult with my friend filologist.
I think that later languages were divided into more tight groups like anglo-sacsonish, finno-ugrish, romanian etc. (sorry for my translation it may be wrong)
Baltic languages, as finnish or karelian belongs to finno-ugrish group.
But, I am not writing to shine with my knowlegde of languages I don't remember much.
I have to say, that this game is a commercial project. That meens, that soonest return of investments is expected by developers and publishers. German market is big enough to release a game into it right away to start getting profit and work on english translation. So, they did it, in german. That was a top priority. But, Gothic 1 had considerable success around the globe. People from different countries were expecting the release of G2. I can understand, that they (uff, we) were confused after seeing german version only. But, that was (and as I see it is) a tactic and approach patch/addon will be released in german only, and english not soon after it, right?
From other hand, I agree, that this is first RPG (if anyone noticed) which has, to it's countless dialog options FULL speech support. Not first dialog, but full support and in english (I donno german) it is made by professionals.
Most games, that were translated into russian to date have awful, non-professional translation and acting.
This is my opinion. Feel free to ruin it  .
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Mon Jul 14, 2003 9:11 pm |
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