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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
Hexy,
I think you are mistaking action and combat length. The Krynn series, betrayal at Krondor, Fallout and the others has turn-based. Not very action oriented. Darklands was real-time. The only prior d&D game I remember playing that was real-time was the Genie game. Eye of the Beholder was semi real time but If I stopped moving the bad guys did also.
How long combat is has nothing to do with action or how much-at least to me. Action to me is how fast I have to react. I like turn-based because i can take my time and use strategy. If every turn based battle takes 20 minutes and the same battle would take 1 minute in real time, there is bound to be less encounters but usually much harder ones. |
Wed Sep 03, 2003 6:52 pm |
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ThouShaltNot
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 27 Feb 2003
Posts: 32
Location: New Zealand |
I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one who thinks that the Quest for Glory series is brilliant. I actually prefer QFG4 to QFG1 because of its gothic fairytale-like atmosphere and incredible music. Also, I think it was the first game I played that actually had a story worth mentioning. |
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Thu Sep 04, 2003 7:07 am |
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corwin
On the Razorblade of Life
Joined: 10 Jun 2002
Posts: 8376
Location: Australia |
I played and enjoyed all 5 QFG games. A delightful series, though not true RPG's to an old schooler like myself.
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If God said it, then that settles it!
I don't use Smileys, I use Emoticons!!
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Thu Sep 04, 2003 7:19 am |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
I have to go with 1. I liked them all but 1 is defininitly my favorite. 5 was wrecked for me because of walkthroughs on the internet (I should probably say it was wrecked by me). But I'm playing through now with the VGA GFG1 so I can't use the razzle dazzle root beer cheat. I had no idea how much different the game is without having every skill. I'm forced to solve puzzles I've always solved one way a new way.
I want to play 5 again but no matter what i do it won't start. It locks up when I hit new, load, or credits. I tried this patched and unpatched. Anyone else have this problem with an xp system? And figure out how to get it to work?
P.S. What happened to the Coles? Why do they have all the speal in the read-me about the only reason they made 5 was for the fans? Did they get sick of making the games? Or something else? Anyone else notice that the Yosimite Enternainment link now goes to a DJ in Yosimite (wherever the hell Yosimite is). I hope the Coles didn't go from making QFG games to DJ'ing at weddings. |
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Fri Sep 05, 2003 4:05 am |
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Guybrush Threepwood
High Emperor
Joined: 19 Jun 2002
Posts: 500
Location: Oklahoma |
a little side note. Alot of those old rpgs weren't even rpgs. They were classified as adventure games. Adventure games have pretty much died out except for Monkey Island and others that Lucas Arts puts out.
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"What are you gonna do? Release the dogs?! Or the bees?! Or dogs with bees in their mouth so that when they bark they shoot bees at you?" - Homer Simpson |
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Sat Sep 27, 2003 2:53 am |
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SirVincealot
Head Merchant
Joined: 21 May 2002
Posts: 50
Location: Toronto |
I feel your pain, Roqua, though for different reasons (I think).
I go into my local software store and see nothing that grabs my attention. Every box blurb I read and every screenshot elicits the same reaction: "I've played this before!" Imagine going to a video store that stopped ordering new releases in 1997 and you'll get the idea.
I had enormously high hopes for BALDUR'S GATE. I really thought a renaissance was upon us where 3D technology would finally enable creative people to stoke out bold new visions.
All we got are old combat simulators (just like those games of yore) in new spiffy clothes. My problem isn't with BALDUR'S GATE. My problem is that similar games (and clones) are all there is!
DEUS EX and GOTHIC seems to be the only games that even bothered making an effort. I heard about the atrocious control scheme of the latter and passed. Maybe GOTHIC II (damm sequels!) will be better . . . who knows.
I invested over 300 hours in MORROWIND; so I certainly got my money's worth! No complaints there. But the reason I did so is because I had, literally, nothing else to buy! That's not a very good reason at all.
I grew up, and gaming didn't. It's the same themes, the same juvenile topics, the same puerile narratives, the same design, even! We are seemingly no closer to an art where from and function will finally embrace - no further than ULTIMA VII.
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"The claymore doth permit me to cut effrontery with sharpened steel" |
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Sun Sep 28, 2003 10:55 pm |
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SirVincealot
Head Merchant
Joined: 21 May 2002
Posts: 50
Location: Toronto |
Few here are arguing that CRPGs have necessarily gotten "worse". I myself find that they simply haven't gotten any better - except in the technical department. A look at TOEE shows that the genre is still retreading the same path as 10 years ago, that the graphics *engine* has gotten better but not the actual art itself and that the gameplay conventions have not changed one iota.
It IS hard to impress me. With all due respect, that argument is spurious: why should it be easy?
NWN should have come out 6 years ago. Make that 10 years ago. Broadband Internet play is no excuse for a game as insipid as that one being released in the new millenium. Spam in a gold can is still Spam.
And while it is true that there are limits to how many "spins" a classic good-evil story can be spun, it is painful to see that computer game writers haven't even begun the list of classical 36 Dramatic Situations delienated in Aristotle's Poetics. Granted that there is quite a bit of similarity between fantasy novels, it is self-evident that there are literally tens of thousands of tales to be told. We've been told exactly 2: "go there and investigate" (a mix of situations #1 and 6: SUPPLICATION, DISASTER) and "go there and get that guy" (#3 and 4: CRIME, VENGEANCE)
I agree that it is up to me to use my imagination. But why should I be the one to do all the work? It is the artists' very job definition to spark it! How many paintings are there in the world? Certainly more than RPGs. I dare say that Impressionism alone counts more works than all the CRPGs ever made since Akalabeth. Like computer games, there's good and there's bad. Point is: we're still finding new painting styles!
To repeat: my disappointment is not that CRPGs have gotten worse. The reason I leave the store empty-handed is that I see nothing as intelligent, as cogent or as provocative as SERPENT ISLE on the racks. And that folks, was 1992.
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"The claymore doth permit me to cut effrontery with sharpened steel" |
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Tue Sep 30, 2003 5:11 pm |
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Hexy
High Emperor
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 621
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I've never had problems with being chained by conservatism.
Even though I've played RPGs for a long long time, I have NO PROBLEM seeing what seperates a game like IceWind Dale 2 from a pile of crap like Dark Heart of Uukrul or Death Knights of Krynn. And it's NOT because IWD 2 has way better graphics and sound. And IWD 2 isn't even THAT good of a game IMO.
A game is NOT like wine. It's doesn't get better as it gets older as some seem to think. I actually can't think of ANY game older than 1996 that has ANYTHING above today's games. CRPGs have generally done NOTHING BUT improved... but of course there are SOME exceptions.
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Like some bold seer in a trance;
Seeing all his own mischance |
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Tue Sep 30, 2003 6:42 pm |
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hoyp
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Oct 2002
Posts: 501
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Rpg's havent gotten worse, they've just changed. |
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Thu Oct 02, 2003 5:20 am |
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Zakhal
Captain of the Guard
Joined: 13 Oct 2002
Posts: 188
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quote:
Originally posted by Dhruin
At the end of the day this is all about an individual's tastes...but I do think we sometimes colour old games with the glow of nostalgia.
Well actually, after decade of drooling i finally acquired myself the whole gold-box serie (i had only tape 64 so reviews and dragonlance books was as far as i ever got) and started playing with it.
I didnt get too far though since i did a small accident and my whole party was annihilated and when i came back the game had not saved all of my party members so i would have to start creating the chars from beginning. Also i noticed i might need mo's slow in battle. But i did have fun playing it. (hey i have had fun playing text based muds so old PoR is like extra since it has real gfx)
As an extra i just got my hands on ToEE which like really kicks ass in ironman (it feels like a _real_ rpg) so i dont have to resort to gold boxes just yet. They can go back collecting dust for now.
Just few years back i played through most of the quest for glory series, all the way from 1-4. (and the first was with original graphics and also best of the series)
I have played ultima 1 and it wasnt really that bad. (i didnt manage to get ultima 2-3 to work though so i had to give up for now)
Betrayal at krondor, best game ever! I still have the original disks but ive played it through so many times i cant be bothered any more. Im still looking for its second sequel, betrayl at antara. The third game in the series was a real letdown though. |
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Thu Oct 02, 2003 6:16 am |
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corwin
On the Razorblade of Life
Joined: 10 Jun 2002
Posts: 8376
Location: Australia |
@Vince I see where you're coming from to some extent; after all, Serpents Isle is one of my all time favourite games. Pity you missed Gothic. Despite the 'original' controls, it was once of the best games since SI. My other favourite was PS-T which tried to be different as well. Can't blame TOEE; it's exactly as advertised, a remake of an early DnD game. It doesn't pretend to be a gaming revolution. I didn't think DX was that revolutionary either; more a mix of RPG and FPS. Are there a lot of boring repetative games out there, yes. PoR2 leaps to mind. However, even though Divinity had a recycled plot, it was one heck of a fun game to play. Look at the small stuff, rather than the big stuff and just maybe you'll find some gems hidden in the chaff.
_________________
If God said it, then that settles it!
I don't use Smileys, I use Emoticons!!
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Thu Oct 02, 2003 6:48 am |
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Guybrush Threepwood
High Emperor
Joined: 19 Jun 2002
Posts: 500
Location: Oklahoma |
I don't know why anyone would say there are no great games before 1996. I rather enjoyed the Zork series...pre-graphics. I just wish Activision would re-lease the Zork text games on CD with all the maps and stuff. Though Zork is the only rpg I've played pre-Atari 2600. The rest were murder mysteries or sci-fi text stuff.
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"What are you gonna do? Release the dogs?! Or the bees?! Or dogs with bees in their mouth so that when they bark they shoot bees at you?" - Homer Simpson |
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Thu Oct 02, 2003 9:24 am |
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ChronoTrigger
Village Leader
Joined: 07 Aug 2002
Posts: 81
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Well .. first of all let me ask you for your forgiveness, if you don't understand/comprenhand a word/sentence of what I will say, Im from Argentina, so is not me  is my English, here I go
1st of all: is everything about tastes, I Know, but the real problem now a days with RPGs (Mostly All Games) is the LOT of Information you can have with a simple search in Yahoo, i see no one mentioned Chronno Trigger, and this is really My all time Favorite along with some others, but I remember, that when i started to play CT, i have NO internet nor Reviews About it, so you play it and most of the things that happens in the game Impress you (although I think, Is the BEST RPG of all times with a great re-re-re playability, different endings, Ups and Downs, etc), but you see, if you wanted to know everything that game has to offer, it was up to you, not the Internet, nor Cheats, Guides, Up to you, another example, on my Own experience was Gothic, I remember that it was one of the first times I downloaded Something From the net, I downloaded It, believing it was a demo, for its size, and it was the Whole game, and Got Amazed by the Inmerssivnes, Great Story, The way it handles the Limitations etc, but again, i didn't know anything about the game, i just install it, and play it (and With no Speech/Videos at all, even with all this things I Missed the first time, the game was a complete 9) Of course i Bought it later On ebay and play it 5-8 times  More, and all those games I can recall all were in some way Different from each other (Final Fantasy 8, CT, Gothic, Zelda - OOT, ALTTP) so i think you have to be less informed about a game to be trully amazed by the work of its devs, of course i did not like NWN at all, it was really Slow, and make me remember Mario 64  , but i play DS, till the end, (a pity the storyline was so weak...hey was there a storyline??  ) all other RPG are in some way Like one you played before, (CT FF ie), when you complain because there are no games Like... is becouse you want more From that game, so you play the sequel, but as it is something ald with a little new you argue with: there is nothing new, and if there is something new, you argue that too (BG --> NWN), but In the end, its in you, The Right Moment to play it, The age, Friends, Interface, Limits, ETC ETC, allways you (Me) so really there is no point at all in this Topic, games are games, and every living parsson have its own tastes, remember, Ignorance sometimes Help
My List:
Chronno Trigger
Final Fantasy 8
Gothic
Zelda a link to the Past
Zelda Ocarina Of Time
Gothic 2
and Maybe:
Ultima 9
Kyrandia... did i just... Ouch!!!
PS: sorry for any bad misspelling etc in this posting
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Fri Oct 03, 2003 7:54 am |
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corwin
On the Razorblade of Life
Joined: 10 Jun 2002
Posts: 8376
Location: Australia |
There is never a need to apologise for your English. You wrote well, and I, for one, understood everything you wrote. Some good points there as well. Nice list.
_________________
If God said it, then that settles it!
I don't use Smileys, I use Emoticons!!
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Fri Oct 03, 2003 8:20 am |
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