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Icewind Dale II Forum Update

(PC: Single- & Multi-Player RPG) | Posted by Myrthos @ Monday - July 01, 2002 - 06:38 -
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Here's something from the IWD2 boards:

    Josh Sawyer

    Charmed
    If a character is charmed by a Charm Person spell, he or she will switch allegiance, but only attack people who attack him/her. If no one attacks him or her, he or she will attempt to aid his or her new allies with buff spells and healing spells. If a character is Dire Charmed, he or she goes hostile to his or her old allies and attacks them in melee. If a character is Dominated, it's bad news. The character will go full offense (spells included) against his or her former allies. If he or she lacks the capability to this, I believe he or she will use healing and buffs on teammates to assist them.


    Point buy
    Not only does the weighted point buy increase the value of the bonus stats, it decreases the value of the penalty stats. If I'm planning on making a high-Dex, low-Con fighter, the elf is the logical choice in the weighted point buy system. The alleged net benefit I gain from the min-maxed weighted point buy system GREATLY outweights the net loss I suffer from the penalty. I jack my Dex up to 16 or 18. The two bonus points I get are worth X points of weighted points. I push my Con up to 12 for a whopping, what, 2 points? Then I let the negligible -2 penalty push it back down.

    However, the whole argument is founded on the illogical premise that a net gain of +1 is worth different values on the sliding scale. The weighted point buy system also doesn't follow the DMG's own allegation that some ability scores are worth more than others (hence the half-orc gaining +2 to Str, -2 to Int and Cha while the elf gains +2 to Dex, -2 to Con).

    * The weighted point-buy system is one of two systems in D&D where the cost to benefit ratio increases in a such a fashion. The other is the cost system for magic items. Skill costs do not increase in such a fashion, for instance.

    * Despite the initial buy cost of the WPB system, no other systems in D&D that relate to ability scores follow this sort of weighted progression. Spells that increase different ability scores (Str and Cha, for instance) by equal amounts can be the same spell level, and items that replicate their effects can be the same cost. These spells and items do not have a tapering effect based on the amount of their benefit or the base to which they are being applied. A Bull's Strength cast on a character with 10 Strength has the same net bonus as a Bull's Strength cast on a character with a 30 Strength. The only limiting factor for these items is the stacking system.

    * To validate the DMG's ability score bonuses and penalties for races, all ability scores must have an established, universal value that applies to all characters. Because, mathematically, it makes no distinction between a fighter, a rogue, or a paladin. Two points of Charisma have the same value to a paladin as they do to a wizard, just as two points of Strength have the same value to a paladin as they do to a wizard.

    Obviously, this is not really the case. Ability scores only have value in the context of their application (examining classes is the most obvious way to appreciate this). Charisma for a sorcerer is, in the vast majority of cases, a very important stat. It is often not a very important stat for a fighter. Strength, it is often reasoned, is of equal value to all characters. This, again, isn't a very well-grounded reason. Perhaps a sorcerer will be in melee often... perhaps he or she will abstain from melee. Perhaps a lightly armored fighter will use a bow and leather armor instead of swords and plate armor. WHO KNOWS?

    They can't know, and that's the problem. The only thing I can be confident about when players make characters is that players will always make the best use of their high statistics, whatever they may be. This is not always the case, but it's pretty rare to find an exception. Who makes a cleric with a high dexterity and then puts heavy armor on and never uses any missile weapons? Who makes a fighter with a high Charisma and doesn't talk and/or load up on speech skills? Who makes a barbarian with a high Strength and never enters melee? Almost no one.

    That, I believe, is a relastic expectation: players will make the best use of whatever their high stats are. If that is the case, I believe that the various ability scores and their bonuses should be given equal value across the board.

    Who benefits from the DMG point buy setup? Only people who go with the grain and make characters in the typical way. E.g.: a half-orc barbarian. Those who attempt to play against type often suffer more under weighted point buy than they would under unweighted. For example, if I chose to make a half-orc bard, the cost to get anywhere near the realm of good scores in Int and Cha is prohibitively expensive. I could spend 20 points on two 16s just to lose many points for 14s in both stats. In a "challenging campaign", that leaves me with two points left over. Not exactly brimming with ability. Playing against type should be difficult, not crippling, IMO.

    Here's another question: is having one 18 really so much better than having two 14s applied to different scores? If not, the bell curve of random score generation loses most of its appeal. The distribution of bonuses in 2nd Ed. made getting an 18 a big deal. In 3E -- who cares?

    Chris Avellone

    Drow
    The -2 XLP definitely causes a big hesitation about using them around here. In the end, their lower hit points than the rest of the party definitely is a disadvantage, especially if they are a mage or sorcerer.

    Tex Yang (Bloodlust)

    Cleave
    There's no "Great Cleave" feat per say, it's alluded to in the "Cleave" feat. The way that it's set up is that the only feat is "Cleave" - taking one rank of cleave will reset the swing they killed the enemy with (which is only good for that one round), while taking two ranks will reset that character back to their first attack, which keeps them on the same "round" until they run out of enemies to attack before moving, or they use up all their attacks without killing their currently engaged enemy.


    Scimitar +5
    Scimitar +5 = 1d6+5, crit threat range 18-20.


    Sneak attacks
    Nope, no sneak attacks with ranged weapons, sorry.


    Envenom weapon
    Envenom weapon does indeed work with ranged weapons.


    Stacking effects
    No, most effects in IWD2 do not stack unless specifically stated that they do, so that a feat that gives +6 and a spell that gives +3 does not become a +9, only the highest stat increase is used, the others will be discarted.


    Feeblemind
    The player will lose control of a character if they're feebleminded (the character themselves will just stand there and do nothing until the spell duration wears off if I remember correctly).


    Mass haste
    Mass haste is the same thing as regular haste, except it's an area effect spell.


    Stunning attack
    Stunning attack can only be used in melee and with an unarmed attack
 
 
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