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| Do the game companies just not give us the deep/meaningful storylines we want, or have we become so attracted to the instant gratification of most games that we've stopped asking for the stories? Who is to blame us, them, or both? |
| Us |
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7% |
[ 1 ] |
| Them |
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30% |
[ 4 ] |
| Both share equal blame |
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61% |
[ 8 ] |
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| Total Votes : 13 |
Provis
High Emperor
Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 872
Location: Middle of the Forest |
I'd kinda say it is both our fault.
Our fault because we (game players in general) keep buying these games with NO story at all.
Their fault because the keep making games with no story.
Though the blame kinda leans to us because they are simply supplying what the public buys, which a company shouldn't ever be blamed for doing, IMO.
I mean why would a company spend an extra couple months and who knows how much money having a great story written for a game when it would sell just as well without the story. |
Thu Jul 11, 2002 5:40 pm |
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Roach
SBR Belfry Bat
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 3233
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I just finished an editorial about this and sent it to Myrthos. I quoted some of you on this thread  , so keep an eye out for it, and read it when it's posted.  If you don't I'll be very sad.  |
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Thu Jul 11, 2002 5:50 pm |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
I just wanted to drop a last note about this interesting subject. I came upon this article on Gamespot's "Gamespotting" weekly editorial page:
http://gamespot.com/gamespot/features/all/gamespotting/071202/p8_01.html
Read this guy's editorial, and you'll understand why we see less and less deep stories in RPG's. I have a creepy feeling that this is the opinion of many gamers out there...
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Mon Jul 15, 2002 8:17 pm |
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Northchild
Fearless Paladin
Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 232
Location: New York, USA |
I may not have used the same words, but I can see where this guy is coming from... though I wasn't a fan of Diablo 2 because it was more of the same. These days, most games with involved dialogue that doesn't really do anything in game-terms get the uninstall vote from me.
Take the PlayStation 2 game "ICO" for example. The story isn't overblown, is used well, and lends to the haunting, beautiful atmosphere. Best of all, the story gets out of the way and lets me play the game. With the single-player campaign of Neverwinter Nights, it's like "Blah blah blah..." |
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Mon Jul 15, 2002 8:45 pm |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
I'm not disputing the quality or quantity of dialogues in NWN, or any game for that matter. But what he's saying in there is that taxt slows him down and that the less there is the better it is, regardless of quality (he bashed BG's text for being intrusive - not his own words, but that's basically what it meant...)
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Mon Jul 15, 2002 10:10 pm |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
One question: Why the hell is that guy playing role-playing games?
I'd like to tell him to go play a FPS and shut up.
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Tue Jul 16, 2002 1:52 am |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
quote:
Originally posted by Val
One question: Why the hell is that guy playing role-playing games?
I'd like to tell him to go play a FPS and shut up.
Amen! Sounds like he's got RPG confused with a small-group tactics shooter.
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=Proud Member of the Non-Flamers Guild=
=Benevolent Dictator, X2/X3 and Morrowind/Oblivion Forums=
Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Tue Jul 16, 2002 2:09 am |
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Windwalking
Fearless Paladin
Joined: 05 Jul 2002
Posts: 227
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quote:
Originally posted by Val
One question: Why the hell is that guy playing role-playing games?
I'd like to tell him to go play a FPS and shut up.
I think this guy looks more like a strategy (turn-based or RTS) gamer than an RPGer or FPSer. He said he liked the tactical element of the Baldurs Gate series, so he should get into games like Heroes, Age of Wonders and that ilk. But then again, he liked Diablo, which is like RPG/Strategy-lite, so who the hell knows what will please the guy... He's probably confused. Or maybe he just isn't smart enough to win at hardcore strategy, and isn't fast or accurate enough at FPS, which leaves RPG to suit his need to dominate things (he says he likes to kill monsters). I think they should just invent a Kill Monster simulator that would just spawn in random creatures onto a never-ending battle screen and the characters would never die. He could leave it on Auto-Play (Auto-Kill?) and kill all the monsters he wants while having a nice little Lunchables snack in the kitchen.
- Wind |
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Tue Jul 16, 2002 2:40 am |
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dteowner
Shoegazer
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 7570
Location: Third Hero of Erathia |
quote:
Originally posted by Windwalking
He could leave it on Auto-Play (Auto-Kill?) and kill all the monsters he wants while having a nice little Lunchables snack in the kitchen.
- Wind
That slam deserves a smilie!  
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Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
RIP Red Wings How 'Bout Dem Cowboys! |
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Tue Jul 16, 2002 2:48 am |
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Dhruin
Stranger In A Strange Land
Joined: 20 May 2002
Posts: 1825
Location: Sydney, Australia |
I think Northchild has really cornered it: a game with the right mechanics can still be fun without a story but not vice versa.
A good story, however, does lift a good game to a piece of genius. I'm sure many of us think Planescape is sublime.
It even works in other genres. Deus Ex had an axcellent conspiracy backstory, as did Half Life. I'm not a fan of RTS but most reviewers quoted the story in Starcraft and lately WC3 as highlights of the single-player game.
So I think we should encourage developers to work on story elements to lift that competent game to a an all-time great.
As for the article on Gamespot... If he wants quest credits for being in the general area in Dungeonsiege (!), why not just develop a game that plays for you. Start the game, watch it choose a character and set off along it's totally linear course, automatically completing combat along the way and racking up all the quests on that map until it cruises through to the credits. The world's first one-click game! Just click Start and it does the rest!
Perhaps his games should just have some opening CGI and then cut straight to the end-credits so the developers don't waste any more time. While he's at it he might change jobs to movie reviews or something less interactive.
Since he points out the pain of reading in a game, perhaps Gamespot should convert to a no-text website. Just a couple of pictures. After all, we hate reading. |
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Wed Jul 17, 2002 10:07 am |
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MoonDragon
High Emperor
Joined: 25 May 2002
Posts: 1254
Location: Waterloo, Canada |
I just read that gamespot blurb. I don't like the guy's attitude (as in I don't go bashing FPS games with an excuse that they give me motion sickness and should therefore be abolished). But, he does make few points (from the wrong perspective, IMHO, but still he's onto something).
I'm playing NWN now and over and over again I'm on the verge of being disgusted by the story. And the implementation of it is almost dead on as he says it. The AI in NWN is at the level of a low budget game made 10 years ago. The game does not respond to your actions at all (for the most part). It seems they were going for quantity rather than quality when it comes to NWN. I keep finding myself squinting at that silly little window in the top left corner, with absolutely microscopic text in it (I'm the person who uses 8pt font while running 1280x960 resolution, so me complaining about size of fonts means something's terribly wrong). After playing NWN for few hours I feel like my eyes are gonna pop out. And I don't have a choice. Every single character you meet has this stupid urge to tell you his life story and the life story of his ancestors 600 years back. Gothic did this fairly nicely. If there was a topic to be discussed, then many NPCs were aware of it. In NWN you have one NPC run up to you, give you this horrendously long "emersion" story, yet the 3 NPCs standing right next to you all along have no clue what you're talking about. Don't get me wrong, I'm not dissing NWN too much. Just pointing out few of the fundamental flaws behind the system.
I guess what I'm getting at is that story is not enough. Presentation of this story is as, if not more, important as the content itself. You know the good old saying: it's not what you say, but how you say it. I mean it's nice that some bard at the court wrote a song about my deeds and that the lord is humming it himself, but telling me this 5 times in a row is ENOUGH! I do not want to hear it one more time!
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Wed Jul 17, 2002 2:34 pm |
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ButtOfMalmsey
Village Idiot
Joined: 07 May 2002
Posts: 785
Location: Mississippi |
I would like to blame everybody. Curse us all. We buy what they want to sell us. I am a Blizzard fanboy, so I have no excuse (I still have both Lost Viking games and Blackthorne hanging around somewhere). But I must say that of all the RPGs out there, the most impressive to me are the Fallout games, Arcanum, and Gothic. I never really liked the tendency of BioWare to have their NPCs vomit up information on the screen. I want a nice conversation simulator, not me asking one sentence questions and getting novels in response.
For my money, the best RPGs are online Mushes, like Elendor (hands down my best non-PnP RPG experience). Because they lack the whizbang graphics, you have to compensate with real content. that I like.
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Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:11 pm |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
quote:
Originally posted by dteowner
quote:
Originally posted by Val
One question: Why the hell is that guy playing role-playing games?
I'd like to tell him to go play a FPS and shut up.
Amen! Sounds like he's got RPG confused with a small-group tactics shooter.
Isn't that the problem these days though? Everything gets an "RPG" tag attached to it and everyone confuses what an RPG should be. This guy clearly don't like RPGs, but he's there ranting about them as if he was a longtime fan of the genre.
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=Member of The Nonflamers' Guild=
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Wed Jul 17, 2002 4:27 pm |
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