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Morrowind just cannot hold my attention
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RPGDot Forums > Morrowind - General

Author Thread
Krogon
Guest






Rendelius makes a good point
   

I agree with Rendelius on the point that just because a person doesn't like a game doesn't mean its not good. If were going to be honest than if a game sells very well and overall gets great reviews there has to be someting good about it. I didn't like Baulders Gate 2. I don't enjoy the top-down type of view. Also small character models I don't care for. But the game sold very well and the reviews were great so I have to admit it was a good game overall.
When Gothic came out I was really excited because it was third person veiw and great graphics. For me, it was a start in the right direction. Than when It bacame very linear and no matter what camp I chose it wasn't much different as far as game play is concerned. Then Morrowind came along and did it just right for me. You have great graphics, many choices on classes, and races. Very open ended and some interesting abilities like Alchemy and Enchanting. I enjoy all the different types of armour you can wear. I enjoy the dialogue and information in the many books you come across. Those are just a few points that I like about Morrowind. Are there faults? Of course, but to me there minor and the upcoming patch will address some of them. Have fun playing Morrowind you guys:)
Post Thu Jun 13, 2002 9:00 pm
 
Joey Nipps
Orcan High Command
Orcan High Command




Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 849
Location: Outer Space
Re: thoughts
   

quote:
Originally posted by bman
A good reviewer is capable of looking at things objectively and determining their quality from an artistic point of view without putting their personal prejudices into it.


I don't disagree. They SHOULD be able to. As we all surely know there are many things that motivate a given individual (reviewer) to write what he/she does. The real world is that reviews do not necessarily represent a technically accurate picture of the product reviewed.

Let's take a simplified look (since we cannot delve inside the minds of the reviewers). What DO we know as a fact? Well on a scale of 1 to 10 (or whatever scale a reviewer uses), a 10 signifies that it is absolutely the best it can be - that IS what a 10 out of 10 means. So if a reviewer gives a game (such as this one) a 10, that means the reviewer is saying the game cannot be any better, else something other than a 10 would be given. This game is NOT the best it can be - that is simple fact. So how has this game received 10s from reviewers? Well it means one of a few "other" possibilities are involved. Reviewers are human and there are many possible motivations (conscious and unconscious) that could cause the reviewer to give a 10. Also, the reviewer might NOT be as technically astute as we would like him/her to be - it happens. He/she could be a fanboy. The point is that when we see a 10 for a review of anything at all - that review is suspect - from a simple logical and technical point of view since NOTHING can be perfect and that is what is being said.

None of us can know the reasons 10s have been given for this game - all that we can know for sure is that it does not deserve a 10 (no game does). These forums (and most of the reviews) are repleat with acknowledgements of the various problems the game has (in many cases there is proper debate about how serious any given problem is) and the hopes that a patch and/or mod will "fix" the issue. With that in mind - how is it possible to not question the validity of any review that gives the game a 10 (or any score very close to that)?


quote:

Moreover, most of the faults can be patched. Serious design flaws are such that they could never be patched away.


I do not disagree - they probably can. The point is that the game should not have been released with so many "faults" that require either a patch or a mod.
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Post Thu Jun 13, 2002 9:02 pm
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Rendelius
Critical Error
Critical Error




Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 16
Location: Austria
   

Joey, I have to correct you in your view on how ratings for games are done. While some reviewers think that a 10 should never be given, because it would mean that there is no way a game could be better, others (including myself) use this scale differently.

For me, a 10 would mean: this game is flawless and the best out there now. I could not think of a game that would fulfill both requirements at the same time, but Morrowind received a 97% here at RPGDot because it is certainly a big leap and does nost things remarkably well.

Now, what if we find that NWN is even better? And later on, Gothic is even better than both other games? We would then downgrade the rating for Morrowind and more recent games. This is common practice with some reputable print magazines, and I think it's a good way to include the effects of "being dated" in some way.

So, yes, there could be a game that can be rated 10 - because 10 doesn't mean perfect.
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Post Thu Jun 13, 2002 9:15 pm
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bman
Guest






ratings
   

yes, 10 does not mean perfect. But since nothing is perfect, a 10 is reserved for the truly groundbreaking, remarkable titles that come around sometimes.

Anyway, what is the point of having a 1-10 scale if 10's are never given?
Post Thu Jun 13, 2002 11:54 pm
 
DoobieScoo
Guest






   

Here's my experience:

I bought the game and immediately fell in love with it. When I left the slave ship for the first time and heard the silt striders wailing in the wind, my jaw hit the floor. As I walked around the first fishing town and started talking to everyone, I thought, this game is going to be really really really cool and I am going to play this game for a loooong time.

I searched a few barrels around town and surprisingly found several gold pieces. I paid the siltstrider attendant and prepared for an awesome journey across the Morrowind landscape

ZAP... I was in the next town immediately; no intermediate animation at all.

So I wandered around the new town and decided to explore. Sadly enough, all the townpeople would repeat the exact same things verbatim as the first townspeople. The shops were very similar and the voice sound clips started repeating almost immediately.

Having been slightly dissapointed with the towns, I decided to investigate the wilderness, for this is where the real action is anyway, right?

After wandering around for a good while and marvelling at the pixel shaded water, I reread the manual. Was I missing something? How do I sit down by the stream? Hmmm.. can't, I gotta stand. Can I make camp? Yeah, but again, like the silt riders, there is simply an immediate transition. "Camping" or "resting" is little more than a fast forward button that refills your health bars.

I found some crypts, dungeons, caves.... they all started to feel the same rather fast. They were filled with the same monsters, used the same textures, and contained the same "treasures".

Within 3 days I had "found" some of the best armor in the entire game and was now wearing it, full set. I was level 4 and no shopkeeper had anywhere near the amount of money required to purchase my armor. Similarly, I "found" one of the best weapons in the game. Level 4, a few hours into the game, and I was maxed.

Monsters were east to slay. In fact, I stopped saving the game altogether... just relying on the "auto-save" to save my progress. Why bother saving when nothing ever threatened me. I could kill anything I came across, anywhere.

As I progressed through the levels, I noticed that the "mosters" appeared different at the same places. These were the infamous "ninja monkeys". These monsters are really the same monsters they always were, the game just loads in a new model and ups there stats to adjust for my level. But all throughout the game, they all only take three wacks to kill.

Now, when I think back to the first day that I played, I realize that the wool was being pulled over my eyes. I was very wrong. I was not going to play this game for a long time after all, for I felt as if I had "beaten it" well before the final battle.

I really saw most of the game the first day of gameplay. Slight variations and new monster models would be occasionally loaded as I leveled, but most everything stays the same. There really was not "thousands of NPCs" after all, but merely a dozen or so that have been cut and pasted all over the landscape. Several cities and towns look identical. Many areas of the wilderness look identical. Instantanous being able to "warp" to the towns compounds the problem.

There are no children in any cities. You cannot camp anywhere. No NPC ever sits down in the entire game... anywhere. You cannot sit down, much less lie down on a bed. Your character is forever standing.

What appeared to be an extremely dynamic world, was but an illusion. The world is dull and static.

Oh, how I wanted to love this game! I really did. I tried to talk myself out of many of its shortcomings. I tried to overlook its flaws and focus on its successes. But at the end of the day I had to sadly admit that I was interacting with nothing but a timid tech demo.

RIP Morrowind.
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 12:06 am
 
sauron38
Rara Avis
Rara Avis




Joined: 14 Jan 2002
Posts: 4396
Location: Winnipeg's Sanctum Sanctorum
   

I pray that the day where I write something like that will not come, but I fear it approaching.
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Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 12:10 am
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guest
Guest






agreed
   

well i have played many RPGS over the years, all myu life, from teh text based MMO games in the days before the interenet existed, Inclduing MUD and L.O.R.D s (if u remember them i commend u) to the mid years of Diablo 1 and Badlurs gate, to their sequals and i have never even heard of the Elder Scrolls games until this one.



Everyone was ranting and raving about this game to the point that they made it seem ... godlike? Like it would change the world or something. Hmmm As far as rpg's go this one sucks !!! there are hardly any unqiue parts of it. Its like they made a virtual world, this is more suites to a MMO game and i bet they orignaly wanted this game to be a MMORPG. But to replace all those PC's that should be there, they put in DRAB NPC's. I wont repeat the previous complaints about the NPC's but i am going to say that its not worth talking to any of the NPC's unless ur directed to in a quest, or maybe one or two per a city.

I have travled across a quarter of the entire land and found only 3 types of monsters, i have seen others but they were conjurations.

I am sticking with helping the Blades and the Mages guild, as i wanbted to be a mages mage but soon found that mages are probably the weakest people in the game. So i decided to custom class myself to a Conjurer (its what i was in BG 2 and man how that game is about a billion times better than this!) although then if ind that i cant even summon a monster more than once at a time!? WHY!? is the game trying to say that there is only one immortal spirit of this monster and that he dies and can be resurected by me? sorry thats not conjuration thats summoning a specific spirit, and well now i am soundingg way to geeky.

Look the game is crap - i want to like it because of the graphics (i keep feeling that i jus thave to play longer and i will see something i am missing) i can play about 20 minutes before i get frustrated with the LONG winded not to mention LONG DISNTACED quests.


anyway this post is getting to long.

the game sucks. Better luck next time, just hope someone can do some good with the excelelnt graphics engine p.s. how about some grassy fields? alls i see is swamps and rock.
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 12:24 am
 
dagem
Eager Tradesman
Eager Tradesman




Joined: 29 Dec 2001
Posts: 49
   

I don't want to start the Morrowind vs Gothic, but the first time I saw a npc walk over to a bush and use the restroom, I almost died laughing. The way the poeple went to bed, cooked and gathered around the fire to talk was awesome.
I will also admit some of the quest in Gothic were lame as well, but I felt as if what I did mattered to the world of Gothic. It seems nothing you do in Morrowind matters, the only time it matters is when you get the "thread of blah blah has been broken" and you have to reload.
I guess my point is if Gothic can script npc's who have a life, (2 years earlier? or maybe a year?) why couldn't Morrowind.
There is a lot of good in Morrowind, but it could have been so much better. Everybody talkes about how big Morrowind is and after I finished it did not seem all that big. I would have rather had a smaller world with more depth and npc interaction.
Why are we the people who PAID for this game supposed to be the ones who fix it? It was such an easy cop out, for them to shove the editor in the box and say there you go.
Too bad as well, the X-Box people came first as well. Hey, take care of the poeple who have already PAID for it, before the people who haven't.
Ok, that's enough for now....

In life and video games - Beauity is only skin deep........
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 1:10 am
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Llama
High Emperor
High Emperor




Joined: 11 Oct 2001
Posts: 509
Location: Earth
   

I personally think a whole Morrowind vs Gothic is a good thing.

It just goes to show you what a developer can do if they put more effort into the game rather than fancy graphical effects. I've been playing Gothic again after quiting MW and have seen even more aspects of the game that absolutely make MW look silly.
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 2:51 am
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Lordr31z
Captain of the Guard
Captain of the Guard




Joined: 11 May 2002
Posts: 190
Location: United States of America
   

If this game sucks so bad and you arent playing it anymore, and you already made your point then go back to the gothic forum.
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 3:50 am
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iloveplywood
Guest






   

No children in the game?? Screw it. I have a strict policy of only playing games where I can sit (not stand) by a stream and watch the children frolic.
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 6:38 am
 
Danicek
The Old One
The Old One




Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 5922
Location: Czech Republic
   

quote:
Originally posted by iloveplywood
No children in the game?? Screw it. I have a strict policy of only playing games where I can sit (not stand) by a stream and watch the children frolic.


Then you have hard work to find game you can play :].
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 7:44 am
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dagem
Eager Tradesman
Eager Tradesman




Joined: 29 Dec 2001
Posts: 49
   

Hey Lordr31z,
1 - What do you have against Gothic players?
2 - I never said this game "sucks so bad"
3 - It's my opinion and I'm entitled to it.
4 - If the npcs in Morrowind were half as good as Gothic, I'd have been happy.


Looks like I still had some more points to make, all valid. Try making a point yourself sometime. You won't bully me into leaving this forum or to changing my mind about Morrowind.
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 9:44 am
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Danicek
The Old One
The Old One




Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 5922
Location: Czech Republic
   

I will add my little note about same dungeons some of your were complaining about.

I am not really far into the game (70+ hours) and I found
- Deadra shrines
- Dwarven ruines
- normal caves
- egg mines
...

Why should I complain that all Dwarven ruines have same style? Same people with same history and architecture style builded them.
Why should I complain that all Deadra shrines are same (not really same, but same mood), same people with same ideas builded them - churches all around the world are also nearly the same).
...

And second note. Here is list of things repaired with mods (I know this is not ideal way, just want to let you know abou this), I will name only those mistakes you named here:
- NPC behaviour
- shops (opening time)
- some stupid animals
- traders with not enough money
- too easy game
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 10:19 am
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GhanBuriGhan
Noble Knight
Noble Knight




Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 208
No fun in Morrowind?
   

Ah, all that negativity. I probably should stop reading here. But hey, let me tell you about what playing MW was like for me yesterday.

Scouting and hunting for ingredients I advanced westward of Seyda Neen, where I just learned some interesting new details about the locals (less generic NPC mod). I hunted some Cliffracers, which is not so easy, as they tend to fly away when the first arrow doesnt kill them, and it never does. When one of them turned to attack me, I knew it must be deseased, and sure enough I felt weakened and sick after the fight (animal realism mod). Good that I had my journeymans alchemy kit with me, I was able to brew myself some medicine that took care of the infection. A little later a wild Kagouti attacked me, and delivered some painful bites, so I had to use one of my healing potions.
Suddenly i spotted a tomb entrance set directly on the coast, below me. I am usually more of an outdoors man, but since I was low on gold, and wanted to upgrade my alchemy equipment for some time now, I thought i would give it a try and see if I could recover some treasure. Sure enough, sneaking down the stairs I saw rows of urns and a magically glowing scroll. Unfortunately the view was kind of obscured by the three bonewalkers. They had not spotted me yet, so I took out my bow and was able to hit each of them with a magic arrow before they were upon me. Then I whipped out my trusted sparck-cleaver. They pressed me hard, but since they were hindering each other on the narrow stairs, I was able to back off at one point to heal myself with a spell. Soon enough they were lying dead.
When I continued to loot the tomb a fiery flash suddenly hit me from the side. Another bonewalker, bigger than the others approached and attacked me with some fiery magic. I didnt hear him coming, some ranger I am! This fight was tougher. I had allready used up my "woad" shield for today, and my supply of healing potions was allready low. I considered fleeing, but I decided against it, fearing another fireball in my back.
This was a tough fight, and at one point he put a foul curse on me, reducing my strength and agility. With my Orcish armor and heavy weapons, I couldnt move anymore, but I could still wield my trusted sword, and finally, all potions used up, and near death, I killed the creature.
I had to lay down all armor and most of my equipment, to be able to walk again, and i had no strength restoring potions with me. When I turned to finally pick up the magic scroll another greater bonewalker rounded the corner. I let the scroll drop and turned to flee. I barely escaped, all my armor and equipment left behind in the tomb with that... thing. Instead of aquiring riches i had lost the most valuable things I had found since arriving on this strange island. Well, I made my way back to Seyda Neen, but I couldnt find the right healing potions there, so I took the siltstrider to Balmora. I purchased enough restoring potions to heal myself, but they cost me my last money. After complaining about my fate over some Matze at the council club (they dont like me there, but they are not quite as unfriendly as the people at the Eight Plates since I tried telling jokes there (entertainers mod)). Spending all your life hunting and tracking in the woods doesn't improve your social skills much, it seems. Since no one was spontaneously buying me any drinks, i went back to Seyda Neen. Now i am standing in front of that cursed tomb again, with no armor but my clothes, and no weapon but my sword, and I know that beast is waiting for me down there. Oh well, here I go again...

(slightly edited for typos and better wording)


Last edited by GhanBuriGhan on Fri Jun 14, 2002 11:59 am; edited 1 time in total
Post Fri Jun 14, 2002 10:44 am
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