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Moriendor
Black Ring Leader
Joined: 19 Jul 2001
Posts: 1306
Location: Germany |
| Gothic 2: Review @ GameSpot |
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GameSpot has posted its <a href="http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/gothic2/review.html" target="_blanK">review</a> of Piranha Bytes' 'Gothic' sequel rating the game at 8.1 out of 10 points.<blockquote><em>Gothic II is a single-player role-playing sequel in which you play as a lone hero who must do battle with bandits, orcs, and dragons in a sprawling 3D world. Like in the first game, you control a soft-spoken hero from a behind-the-back perspective and follow one of three career paths in pursuit of his ultimate goal--which, in this case, is to stave off an assault by orcs and dragons unleashed by the death of a demon, the same one that he defeated at the end of the first game. While Gothic II has various improvements, it retains the clunky 3D control scheme for movement and combat used in the first game, and it's just as unforgiving, if not more so. However, if you're up for a challenge, have a fairly good computer, and don't mind the control scheme, you'll find that Gothic II has plenty to offer.</em></blockquote> |
Tue Nov 18, 2003 7:09 am |
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Guest
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'Clunky control scheme'.
Mainstream games reviewers must be the stupidest, most useless people on the planet.
An "8.1" for a game in a series which revolutionises RPG gameworld and NPC interaction, realism, and quality.
As the Americans would say, 'Whatever'. |
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Tue Nov 18, 2003 7:12 am |
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dagon
Village Dweller
Joined: 12 Jul 2001
Posts: 7
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| Gamespot goes down one point for their Gothic II review |
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I don't understand why Gothic 1/2 are so underrated.
Here in France nobody knows about them... Here in Strasbourg, the BEST video game shopkeeper thought it was a doomlike (Gothic 1 was never released here) 
For me it's one of the best CRPG I ever played. |
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Tue Nov 18, 2003 7:23 am |
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Nathan_Paige
Village Dweller
Joined: 02 Nov 2003
Posts: 5
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Well I can't speak for the rest of the world but I think I know why its under rated here in the US.
Unfortunately most of us americans like things to conform to a standard and operate in that fashion. We like things to work the same as other things, most of us americans really don't give a squat when it comes to trying something "different".
(note I am NOT speaking for everyone, just many people I know in my circle of gamers where I live heehee)
A good comparison to what may happen to this game is music actually. Country Music. I was watching a "behind the scenes" on Toby Keith the other day. Excellent singer, put out hit after hit after hit, but still didn't win awards in country music for years. His music went against the "standard" set by country music's already famous and as such be doing things his own way he had a REALLY hard time getting the recognition he deserved.
I think Gothic 1 and 2 follow into that same situation. They don't follow the "standard" for rpg games when it comes to gameplay. Your average teenager is going to look at this game and its controls then look at something like dungeon seige, morrowind, or neverwinter nights...and will play one of those simply because its easier to control from the start, and requires less thought to play 
Like Toby though, I strongly believe this game will see its recognition in time, it will just take that time though and even then it probably won't be on the level it deserves.
This is a unfortunate thing I agree, I wish games were given what they deserved not based on their advertising and game controls, but instead on what they have to offer the gamer, the content. The story. The level of emersiveness that this game provides
I haven't played a game like this in a LONG time, it has me hooked, and laughing through and through.
I just hope its lack of deserved attention dosen't prevent further development of the series, Long live Gothic! |
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Tue Nov 18, 2003 5:16 pm |
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Guest
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quote:
Originally posted by Anonymous
'Clunky control scheme'.
Mainstream games reviewers must be the stupidest, most useless people on the planet.
An "8.1" for a game in a series which revolutionises RPG gameworld and NPC interaction, realism, and quality.
As the Americans would say, 'Whatever'.
Indeed! Such interaction and realism wasn't started by Gothic (take a look at Ultima 7 and Ultima Underworld -- Ultima 5 was the first I know of to have NPC schedules), but it is certainly the first in a very long time to bring such things into modern computer technology. Not only that, but it did a fantastic job of it.
-Ostsol |
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Wed Nov 19, 2003 12:03 am |
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Roqua
High Emperor
Joined: 02 Sep 2003
Posts: 897
Location: rump |
I have no problem with Gothic I controls after remapping them all and playing for a while. My problem with Gothic I was that it died for me after chapter 1 (or was it 2). I had a ball in chapter 1 and played through it a bunch of times, but then I looked at playing as more of a chore than anything.
I will prbably pick up Gothic II when I get a chance (my wife is due with our daughter the beggining of next month and that work and school are keeping me from playing anything, and Kotor looks more intersting to me but I am waiting for non-console reviews because I am not a huge fan of console-rpgs). None of the reviews I've read addressed what i didn't like about Gothic I, but I will get it to chip in my share to add to realism in gaming rpgs (or action games with strong RPG elements in Gothics case).
_________________
Vegitarian is the Indian word for lousey hunter. |
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Wed Nov 19, 2003 12:40 am |
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Lucky Day
Guest
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this is quite possibly the best review of this game I've seen.
the only reason I see why this game gets so much bias on the site is because there are so many Europeans on it.
you have to realize the controls are pathetic and and so is pathfind, inventory, combat, etc. I know you can try to look past that but out of the starting gate it makes it unplayable.
and these problems aren't new: they were there in the first game and they are still there in the sequel.
before you trash gamespot for pointing out the obvious errors this reviewer also pointed out what is good in the game.
I'm a single player CRPG fan. I do not like Diablo et al. but the issues with this game made me put it down after 20 minutes. you can't make a game that cumbersome. |
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Wed Nov 19, 2003 2:08 am |
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Moriendor
Black Ring Leader
Joined: 19 Jul 2001
Posts: 1306
Location: Germany |
First of all, I'd like to agree with you Lucky that the review at GameSpot is a good one and 8.1 is a great score in my opinion.
But then you disappoint me, Lucky. Not sure if we have played the same versions of Gothic or if I just got lucky but I haven't had any of the issues you've listed.
And welcome to the club of "My-attention-span-is-shorter-than-that-of-a-goldfish" people. The controls in the original Gothic take a little time to get used to but Gothic II is much more customizable. Oh well, you probably didn't get that far in those 20 minutes.. too bad. |
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Wed Nov 19, 2003 2:21 am |
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Guest
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quote:
Originally posted by Lucky Day
this is quite possibly the best review of this game I've seen.
the only reason I see why this game gets so much bias on the site is because there are so many Europeans on it.
you have to realize the controls are pathetic and and so is pathfind, inventory, combat, etc. I know you can try to look past that but out of the starting gate it makes it unplayable.
and these problems aren't new: they were there in the first game and they are still there in the sequel.
before you trash gamespot for pointing out the obvious errors this reviewer also pointed out what is good in the game.
I'm a single player CRPG fan. I do not like Diablo et al. but the issues with this game made me put it down after 20 minutes. you can't make a game that cumbersome.
Well it's your loss that you couldn't spend an hour learing how to play one of the greatest games EVER. This review is for you. The reason people on this site love Gothic 1/2 is because they are great games and control schemes and difficult combat are trivial problems to overcome. |
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Wed Nov 19, 2003 2:33 am |
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Kiwi Boy
High Emperor
Joined: 03 Jan 2003
Posts: 1086
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The reviewer also mentions inconveniences other than controls in G2:
There isn't any shortcut key for potions. You can't take note of landmarks (e.g. locations of merchants in city Khorinis) in the map. No instant transportation, even though the world is quite huge. And a limited number of entries for saved games. (Of course, you can make your own backups, but many people can't/won't go "deep" into the directories.)
I can imagine many players rely heavily on these "modern" features, and certainly, most of them won't tolerate the fact that G2 doesn't have them. What do you think about these "annoyances"? Do you think PB should seriously consider adding these "user-friendly" features to the game?
The UI of a program is like plumbing in a building. If it goes well, the users neither praise nor bash about it; they don't even feel it exists. If it's awkward (unconventional?), the game is relatively "unplayable", regardless of how great the game is. I found that many aspects of the UI, including controls and inventory system, still need some serious improvements. Let's hope PB will do something about it in the next Gothic. |
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Tue Nov 25, 2003 3:26 am |
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Cm
Sentinel of Light
Joined: 26 Jan 2003
Posts: 5209
Location: Missouri USA |
If you use the new G2 controls you do get a short cut key for health potions and mana potions you can hit during battle. What is confusing is that the game sets up the old controls for G1 automaticly. You have to change it to G2 if you want to use them. And in the English version, you do not get to select the keys, they are hard set as H for health and P for mana. The directions are a little unclear on this. You do have extra key options in the new controls, but have to go to bottom of the list and have back highlighted, then hit tab to get to the extra keys. I found that out almost by accident. The Battle controls for the new G2 controls was confusing as well. Playing with the mouse after a battle was how I found out I could use it the straff ect. just touching mouse buttons. They certainly need a regular player to rewrite the instructions for people who do not have degrees in computer science. Once I figured it out I liked it much better than the G1 controls.
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Tue Nov 25, 2003 4:05 am |
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hwfanatic
Average Fanatic
Joined: 28 Oct 2002
Posts: 2850
Location: Belgrade, Serbia |
quote:
Originally posted by Kiwi Boy
There isn't any shortcut key for potions.
Oh, but there are... I would only like to add to what cm said, that the strongest potion is picked automatically, so you wouldn't want to use a shortcut if yu're not seriously injured.
quote:
You can't take note of landmarks (e.g. locations of merchants in city Khorinis) in the map.
This is truly a flaw, although, the game has no pointer, so that might be one of the reasons.
quote:
No instant transportation, even though the world is quite huge.
No offense, but this is just rubbish... The quests iteslf don't give you the experience required for you to get the game done. If you didn't stroll off the road once in a while, you wouldn't get nearly enough exp...
quote:
And a limited number of entries for saved games. (Of course, you can make your own backups, but many people can't/won't go "deep" into the directories.)
I would say 20 slots is quite a number, keeping in mind that each save can take upto 10 Mb of hdd space. The only flaw would be lack of personalized saves i.e. the fact that G2 uses a generic location for storage of saves and not the user's directories. |
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Tue Nov 25, 2003 11:33 pm |
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Dhruin
Stranger In A Strange Land
Joined: 20 May 2002
Posts: 1825
Location: Sydney, Australia |
I don't really understand the transport complaint. Although the world is large the linear distances aren't that great. And further into the game there's teleport runes, anyway.
_________________
Editor @ RPGDot |
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Tue Nov 25, 2003 11:55 pm |
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Gorath
Mostly Harmless
Joined: 03 Sep 2001
Posts: 6327
Location: NRW, Germany |
quote:
Originally posted by Dhruin
I don't really understand the transport complaint. Although the world is large the linear distances aren't that great. And further into the game there's teleport runes, anyway.
Especially this complaint is absolutely easy to understand. You find the first teleport rune about 30 seconds after entering the valley of mines in early chapter 2. While this rune can be overlooked if you´re blind, in chapter 3 you cannot avoid receiving teleport runes.
It´s unlikely the reviewer remembered this wrong, so he most probably never encountered the runes. Ergo: He only played chapter 1. Like most 'professional' reviewers out there he only spent a few hours on the game, drew his conclusions on the beginning and extrapolated them for the rest of the game.
This explains the 2 big mistakes (not mentioning the alternative combat control system is the other) and all the smaller ones. It was nothing more than luck that his final score and some parts of the review still sort of fit.
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Webmaster GothicDot |
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Wed Nov 26, 2003 1:08 am |
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Val
Risen From Ashes
Joined: 18 Feb 2002
Posts: 14724
Location: Utah, USA |
After seeing this thread I'm not so sure it's a bad thing that he didn't finish. I was hoping they had improved on that, but it's looks like another cop-out villian awaits at the end of G2 for me when I pick it up from the bargin bin. Such a depressing thought. I'm glad I'm waiting. 
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Wed Nov 26, 2003 1:34 am |
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