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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
| Ekim's Gamer View: Death and the Norse Maiden |
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<P><A href="http://www.mmorpgdot.com/index.php?hsaction=10053&ID=896">Mythica is dead in the womb</A>. Earlier this week Dialogue tried to analyse the Why's and the How's. I'll try and see where this event will lead us instead. What kind of impact will Mythica's death have on the MMORPG genre?</P>
<BLOCKQUOTE><I>
<P>If you put yourself in the shoes of other, smaller publishers for a second, and you look at Microsoft’s decision from their perspective, you’d probably be scared. What did Microsoft see of the future that they haven't? Mythica reportedly had everything to be successful, so why cancel it? In the next few weeks there will be some very nervous accountants hitting the books because of this event.</P></I></BLOCKQUOTE>
<P>Hope you enjoy this week's EGV, and be sure to let us know how you think this event will shape the future of MMORPGs by leaving us your comments!</P> |
Fri Feb 20, 2004 10:45 pm |
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Ammon777
Warrior for Heaven
Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 2011
Location: United States |
Amen Ekim! I am in total concert with your thinking concerning this. In fact, our deductions are so similar i thought i would reinstate what i said about this stuff a few days ago elsewhere (not trying to be redundant or anything).
"Journalists are so clueless. The problem isnt too few players, or too many games. The problem is too many sucky games. There i said it... another thing. this journalist is taking data out of context and making stupid assumptions with it. the cancellation of Mythica was a GOOD THING FOR THE INDUSTRY. we need more frequent cancellations to make this genre thrive, and we need more frequent cancellations to send a message to publishers that they need to be more competitive, and to do so, they need to LISTEN TO THE CUSTOMERS instead of ignorantly taking the fatal steps that Artifact Retarded-tainment took when they decided that CORPORATE MONKEYS know more about game design than the actual players. (since when do they know anything besides business and sucking up to the boss?)
Come on, listen to the players! You want our money? Then make what WE THE PLAYERS want to play instead of what your boss thinks comprises a good roleplaying game. The players are the REAL judges here, and frankly if we dont enjoy your game, that shows that YOU THE DEVELOPERS are clueless.
Cancel a number of games to make the genre more competitive: up the competition, up the complexity, up the quality, up the overall selection, and you have upped the satisfaction of customers. By ignoring your players, you are making a FATAL MISTAKE for your game. So go ahead and make your game in the closet populated by your few diehard fanboys. It will fail.
The reason i say these things is because i know multitudes of players that are still waiting for the next good MMOrpg to come out. Myself included. We are waiting, and we are many. There are so many of us, that if we all bought one MMORPG right now, i bet there would be at least 750,000 of us, and i am not kidding. There are so many disgruntled MMO players out there that are waiting on specific games that developers have not reached yet because they havent made anything worthy to attract us. Soon that will change, because the good games are coming. 2004-2005 will see a growth of players in the genre, i am betting, that will make 2003 look like the one of the worst years for MMORPG releases. Just my opinion, although i know im right." |
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Fri Feb 20, 2004 10:52 pm |
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Ammon777
Warrior for Heaven
Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 2011
Location: United States |
i dont put it near as nicely as Ekim -- since, hey! im not a responsible editor! woot! -- but we are saying practically the same thing, as well as what Dialogue was saying this last week. |
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Fri Feb 20, 2004 10:56 pm |
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GhanBuriGhan
Noble Knight
Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 208
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I am not sure I can follow Ekims argument. I interpret that he means that the death of a few projects will mean that the rest will become better - that more effort will be put into producing interesting, varied, innovative games to secure a successful launch and continued player interest, instead of seeing MMORPGs as a mere cash cow where you can do anything and get your money back. But for me (as an outsider admittedly) this does not seem to be the situation. Already a number of recent MMORPGs seem to have failed or remained below expectations, and I am sure the industry is quite aware of that (it is the cited reason for Mythicas cencellation). Also, by all accounts Mythica was a game that put quite a lot of value in producing something original and had a number of innovative features - so how can it be a good sign that it is this one, one of the more innovative Projects, that failed? How will a situation, where publishers and developers will naturally feel disinclined to invest in long and costly development times benefit quality and innovation? Add to that the fact that the most successful game is still Everquest - once an innovative game, but now exactly what people in this community want to get away from? |
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Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:34 am |
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Ekim
Eagle's Shadow
Joined: 27 May 2002
Posts: 2365
Location: Montreal, Canada |
quote:
Originally posted by GhanBuriGhan
I am not sure I can follow Ekims argument. I interpret that he means that the death of a few projects will mean that the rest will become better - that more effort will be put into producing interesting, varied, innovative games to secure a successful launch and continued player interest, instead of seeing MMORPGs as a mere cash cow where you can do anything and get your money back.
No, you're putting words in my mouth  I was not talking about the deaths of a "few" projects, but the impact of the death of Mythica alone, which *might* (might, mind you, might) be followed by the death of other ones as a consequence. And I didn't say that it will make games more varied of more innovative, but that it would be helpful to move the genre in a new direction. Yes, it could make future games better because publishers might become more careful about what they offer, and stop seeing the genre *only* as a great big cash cow.
quote:
Originally posted by GhanBuriGhan
Already a number of recent MMORPGs seem to have failed or remained below expectations, and I am sure the industry is quite aware of that (it is the cited reason for Mythicas cencellation).
Please keep in mind that I'm talking about long-term repercussions here. The only short-terms consequences you *might* see are the cancelations of other games. But the games that are currently advanced in their development will probably not be affected in their gameplay by this event.
quote:
Originally posted by GhanBuriGhan
Also, by all accounts Mythica was a game that put quite a lot of value in producing something original and had a number of innovative features - so how can it be a good sign that it is this one, one of the more innovative Projects, that failed?
Precisely because it was Microsoft that was behind it. If it had been any other smaller publisher then we wouldn't be talking about this now.
If anyone could have suffered a $30million loss while developping a game like Mythica, knowing that the returns would have been greater in the long run, it would have been Microsoft. But here they offer a very bold statement because by cancelling Mythica they are more or less saying that the returns would not have been interesting enough. And, as I said in my article:
quote:
Originally posted by EGV
If Microsoft was willing to flush 20 million dollars down the toilet for a game that was, by all accounts, bound to be successful at least in the first few months, how do you think a small publisher will feel about half of that amount for games that have half the expected success?
In the end the potential financial results were not enough to convince Microsoft that they should continue to invest their money in this project, as seemingly successful as it would have been. That's saying a lot, I think.
quote:
Originally posted by GhanBuriGhan
How will a situation, where publishers and developers will naturally feel disinclined to invest in long and costly development times benefit quality and innovation?
Because it could have the effect of making publishers more careful about which projects they should, or shouldn't go forward with. Up until now publishers were probably just asking where to send the check to when they heard the "mmorpg" magic word. Now they might start thinking twice about it, and make sure that they have something good on their hands before investing (might, mind you, might).
quote:
Originally posted by GhanBuriGhan
Add to that the fact that the most successful game is still Everquest - once an innovative game, but now exactly what people in this community want to get away from?
But that's just the normal way of things. 5 or 6 years ago people only swore by Baldur's Gate types of games. Now they're saying that it's time to move on. In a few years a game will come out which will take over the EQ legacy, and after a while people will complain because everyone will be trying to immitate that one. It's the natural law of gaming evolution I guess 
_________________
=Proud Father of a new gamer GIRL!=
=Member of The Nonflamers' Guild=
=Worshiper of the Written Word= |
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Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:04 pm |
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Ammon777
Warrior for Heaven
Joined: 20 Apr 2002
Posts: 2011
Location: United States |
also, Microsoft probably pulled Mythica out because of all the competition. There is a rabid fanbase behind each one of these i am listing here. Listen, in the upcoming months, we will have many choices, most of which will spread the playerbase out among a large variety and some of which will be where large concentration of players will reside. Microsoft looked over the entire upcoming landscape of the genre and saw correctly that there are VERY decent games coming that would compete directly with Mythica, so they pulled out. Like Ekim said, Overall, its a good thing.
The BIG games are (in case you live under a rock):
-- Dragon Empires (excellent environmental graphics, state of the art design)
-- Everquest 2 (many EQ players will play this + me who never played EQ)
-- World of Warcraft (HUGE following, might be bigger than EQ; the next EQ?)
-- Darkfall Online (extremely RABID playerbase, moreso than any other game)
-- Guild Wars (attractive because nice graphics and NO SUBCRIPTION fee!)
-- whatever Sigil Games Online is working on (already has a loyal fanbase)
-- UltimaX Odyssey, Lineage 2, City of Heroes, Middle Earth Online, D&D Online
-- this doesnt even mention all the games in production that arent announced yet...
-- plus all the games that are smaller that could be niche hits (Trials of Ascension)
can you see why Microsoft looked at all of these and realized that it would be better to invest somewhere else? i mean, each of those games will have at least 100,000 people playing them in the long run, unless some are failures (which i doubt). But when you have ten big projects coming out and numerous smaller projects, i can understand why Microsoft pulled out right now. This doesnt mean Microsoft wont return to the genre later, though. I am sure they will, eventually. When things look better and there are fewer, yet better, games on the future market.
The thing is, that each of these new games brings in a group of more NEW BLOOD players. The more BIG games coming out, the more the playerbase grows. Some developers think it is stagnant right now, but thats wrong because i know people who will play World of Warcraft who, three years ago, claimed that they would NEVER play any MMORPG ever at all. Lo and behold, these people fibbed partly because they didnt know that something to their liking would ever come out. Most of those people are playing MMORPGs right now already because they have realized that much promise lies in this category for players. |
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Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:32 pm |
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