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bosh
Village Dweller
Joined: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 8
Location: Lincoln, UK |
| Time it takes to finish a game. |
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I love RPG's, but I work full time, have a daughter of 6 months and so have very little time to play them, maybe 1 or 2 hours a day - but not every day. Because of this I find it takes me ages to go up levels, so the game gets boring. The major plot twists do not happen often enough to keep me interested.
I think games are designed for younger people who can dedicate many more hours a day to playing. I would like a facility where I could say how many hours I am able to dedicate to the game per week at the start so that I can go up levels quicker. I do not want baddies easier to kill or puzzles easier to solve.
Does anyone else think this would be useful to them?
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Repent, redeem, revenge and deploy. |
Sat Jul 26, 2003 9:44 am |
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stanthony
One Smart Dog
Joined: 28 Oct 2002
Posts: 556
Location: Tallinn, Estonia |
Hm... I do not know about quick level gaining really... I think it's quite hard to implement in reality. However, maybe if you feel like quick leveling is going to solve your problem you should try playing party-based RPG (such as BG, IWD or Wiz8 for that matter) solo. XP points that normally would go to, say, 6 characters will all fly to you. Leveling is pretty fast this way 
Try it?
_________________
- Druids do not fight with metal weapons! Sit here, and you over here. Put the elbows of your right arms on the table...
- Arm-pulling? Get me back me pan!
R.A.Salvatore The Cleric Quintet. Canticle |
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Sat Jul 26, 2003 12:03 pm |
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ThouShaltNot
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 27 Feb 2003
Posts: 32
Location: New Zealand |
A good RPG should be designed to hold your interest regardless of the levelling pace. Yes, game developers could increase the pace for people who don’t play for 6 hours each day, but this would be avoiding the real issue. You said: “The major plot twists do not happen often enough to keep me interested.” I think THIS is what needs to be fixed, not the speed that your character levels up.
The problem with many RPGs at the moment is that most of their content is what I consider filler material – wading through legions of identical enemies using identical tactics for hours on end without advancing the plot at all. This artificially extends the time needed to finish the game, without actually being fun for a lot of the time (unless you enjoy repetitive hack and slash).
I would prefer to have a smaller number of interesting encounters accompanied by rapid plot advancement. If this means reducing the time it takes to finish the game, then so be it - I consider plot density to be more important than game length. My dream RPG would have a story so continually absorbing that I would worry less about my character’s stats than his/her place in the gameworld. Unfortunately no one has made my dream game yet… |
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Sat Jul 26, 2003 12:50 pm |
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Hexy
High Emperor
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 621
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Actually, most "filler encounters" occur when you travel around alot and do side-quests. Sure, if you progress through the main plot only, you'll meet many identical creatures, but not that many.
Furthermore, I like a game that takes time and effort, nothing that's finished over a day. Makes me feel that my money doesn't go immediately to waste. I want many hours of entertainment from a product and I see nothing bad with wanting a plot that draws out like in a book, plus spending your money well. Besides, how epic can your story lines be in a 10 hour game? How many of those boring "sequence jumpings" would you get? Pretty much.
The plot would probably become boring, hard to follow, hollow and silly, if everything just paces on with the main character(s) fighting maybe once or twice, wade through a little dialogue and then already begin sighting the finish line.
A little COMPLEXITY wouldn't hurt.
I have played through very few games in which the ACTUAL main plot is slow and boring. The time waster is the side-stuff, which very often, IS OPTIONAL.
_________________
Like some bold seer in a trance;
Seeing all his own mischance |
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Sat Jul 26, 2003 1:42 pm |
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bosh
Village Dweller
Joined: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 8
Location: Lincoln, UK |
Often the side-quests ARE important because they are there, often, to boost your levels which gives you the ability to do the next part of the game.
_________________
Repent, redeem, revenge and deploy. |
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Sat Jul 26, 2003 2:40 pm |
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Danicek
The Old One
Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 5922
Location: Czech Republic |
It is possible not right place to say it - but I have also not long hours to play (this is new thing for me, because I had them).
So some games are simply too long for me. Currently I need games with certain story/quests/problems solving. Because when I play game with long complicated quests, I am simply lost. |
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Sat Jul 26, 2003 6:10 pm |
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ThouShaltNot
Eager Tradesman
Joined: 27 Feb 2003
Posts: 32
Location: New Zealand |
Ah, Hexy, my favourite rebutter. 
quote:
Originally posted by Hexy
Actually, most "filler encounters" occur when you travel around alot and do side-quests. Sure, if you progress through the main plot only, you'll meet many identical creatures, but not that many..
Really? From my experience, most games that have "filler encounters" for the side quests have just as many for the core plot.
quote:
Originally posted by Hexy
Furthermore, I like a game that takes time and effort, nothing that's finished over a day. Makes me feel that my money doesn't go immediately to waste. I want many hours of entertainment from a product and I see nothing bad with wanting a plot that draws out like in a book, plus spending your money well. Besides, how epic can your story lines be in a 10 hour game? How many of those boring "sequence jumpings" would you get? Pretty much.
The plot would probably become boring, hard to follow, hollow and silly, if everything just paces on with the main character(s) fighting maybe once or twice, wade through a little dialogue and then already begin sighting the finish line.
I like long plots that draw out like in a book, but many long games don't have long plots. They have short plots that are padded out by large amounts of repetitive combat. How does a 100 hour game with 10 hours worth of plot have a more epic story than a 20 hour game with 10 hours worth of plot? I find the story becomes boring, hard to follow, hollow and silly if the game is padded out with 80 hours of pointless fights that do nothing to further the story. I can just imagine what a book would be like if it was written like this:
"Bert stepped forward into the gloomy dungeon and was immediately set upon by an orc. He slew it with ease and proceeded onwards. Three seconds later another orc jumped out of the shadows. Bert slew the orc. He walked forward cautiously. Another orc charged him and he slew it. Then another orc appeared before him and he slew it. Followed by another orc..."
I'm not saying that all RPGs do this, but a lot of them do.
quote:
Originally posted by Hexy
I have played through very few games in which the ACTUAL main plot is slow and boring. The time waster is the side-stuff, which very often, IS OPTIONAL.
As I said, I haven't noticed much difference between the side-quest content and the main-quest content in most games. Besides, I think the side quests should be interesting in their own right story-wise, or there's little point in having them.
Maybe in the future RPGs could be given 2 modes: LOTS-A-HACK, for people with plenty of time on their hands who enjoy hack and slash, and HACK-LITE, which would have a smaller number of encounters of each type (but award more experience for each individual encounter), for people who don't have the time, or don't consider it fun, to wade through masses of identical enemies. |
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Sun Jul 27, 2003 1:53 am |
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Hexy
High Emperor
Joined: 28 Jun 2002
Posts: 621
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Well then, ThouShaltNot, I won't disappoint you  . And debating with you is certainly not boring.
quote:
Originally posted by ThouShaltNot
I like long plots that draw out like in a book, but many long games don't have long plots. They have short plots that are padded out by large amounts of repetitive combat. How does a 100 hour game with 10 hours worth of plot have a more epic story than a 20 hour game with 10 hours worth of plot? I find the story becomes boring, hard to follow, hollow and silly if the game is padded out with 80 hours of pointless fights that do nothing to further the story. I can just imagine what a book would be like if it was written like this:
"Bert stepped forward into the gloomy dungeon and was immediately set upon by an orc. He slew it with ease and proceeded onwards. Three seconds later another orc jumped out of the shadows. Bert slew the orc. He walked forward cautiously. Another orc charged him and he slew it. Then another orc appeared before him and he slew it. Followed by another orc..."
I'm not saying that all RPGs do this, but a lot of them do.
Sure, games like Diablo, Dungeon Siege and Divine Divinity etc. would fit your description accurately, but there's QUITE the differance between Diablo and Baldur's Gate.
Let's look closer at Baldur's Gate (always a good example). Now, there's a load of running around (first to this town, then this place, then wander around through this forest). Sure, there are a lot of combat and stuff like that, but honestly, you'd think the evil wizard who's taken over a huge mining-system would have SOME guards, right?
I mean, were talking these fantasy badasses in an epic plot, of course they ought to have ARMIES of stuff to defend themselves and attack with, otherwise they wouldn't be much of a threat. You know, much like in most fantasy movies/books. For me, it adds to the whole "feel" of a fantasy setting, you know, fighting monsters and rogues.
But point is, Baldur's Gate is like 100 hours if you do EVERYTHING, but is scaled down to like 40 or 50 hours if you only follow the 7 chapter plot, spanning across the sword-coast. Yes, some fighting still, but we're certainly not talking Diablo here.
Furthermore, there needs to be some kind of huge obstacles for the adventurers, and combat is a great way of doing this. Dialogue isn't as good, since all you need to do is a little trial and error and reloading to get through. a hard battle presents more of a challenge.
quote:
Originally posted by ThouShaltNot
As I said, I haven't noticed much difference between the side-quest content and the main-quest content in most games. Besides, I think the side quests should be interesting in their own right story-wise, or there's little point in having them.
Maybe in the future RPGs could be given 2 modes: LOTS-A-HACK, for people with plenty of time on their hands who enjoy hack and slash, and HACK-LITE, which would have a smaller number of encounters of each type (but award more experience for each individual encounter), for people who don't have the time, or don't consider it fun, to wade through masses of identical enemies.
Well, I can't say I disagree. I mean, it wouldn't hurt anyone to have two modes.
And, side-quests sometimes do have a little something to do with the plot story-wise. Just look at the Fallouts.
_________________
Like some bold seer in a trance;
Seeing all his own mischance |
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Sun Jul 27, 2003 6:41 am |
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RedTiger
Village Leader
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Posts: 93
Location: Center of Chaos |
I've played BG2 a few times through once trying to do all of the side quests and once just the main plot. what I gained in time by doing just the main story I lost in getting some powerful items. |
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Tue Aug 19, 2003 2:45 pm |
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