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Dez
King of the Realms
Joined: 08 Jan 2003
Posts: 455
Location: Fortress of Tell Halaf |
quote:
Originally posted by ToddMcF2002
G2 blows away the graphics of most games made today once you consider the draw distances. Half Life and Doom 3 really don't impress me - lots of detail in (relatively) confined areas? G2 is pretty amazing frankly.
In fact, ever since Blade Of Darkness came out I've started thinking the foriegn games are simply better - depth of complexity, technically etc. I guess the producers have less of a meddling hand in development. Especially in innovation - Arx Fatalis anyone? Gothic?
Only Bethesda breaks the mold in my opinion. Not yet a true Morrowind lover, but I can't discount the game's technical or innovative attributes.
Gothic 2 is the most impressive game I've ever played however. Bioware is out to lunch technically.
yes it is quite true that foreign studios have ability to make cool innovations.Bod, arx, gothic are my favorite games.From the other genres max payne or Mafia as great action games pop into my mind, also made by foreign studios.Or then we have silent storm being one of the best freaking strategy game ever with stunning visuals and physics.Or from wargames hidden and dangerous I and II, which are must for every ww2-movie fan.Finally but not last a true masterpiece, work of art: OUTCAST from the belgian developer called appeal(which has been long dead by now).
Still all those games shine what comes to craphics or won't shame at the very least when compared to other of genre's more popular games.Bod for instance has such beautifull shadows that even today's games have hard time cathing same level.For me craphics are not the factor why i play games.Otherwise i wouldn't play any "older" games.Thought it is quite hard to deny that the eye-kandy has a hell of lot importance alluring new players. We scarred rpg-game veterans will play even less polished game if some of the more important areas are allright. But if you want to sell your game you must have certain level of eye kandy in your game.
I didn't mean to say that UDC was ugly, hell it is far from it!I honestly like the outdoor scenery, they are allmoust like paintings  It really reminds me about gothic too.My only grip is that the models and the animation don't look so good.But to be honest gothic's models are not that great either. Still like sem said, g2 was released at the end of 2002 in germany or 2003 in world wide.So these kind of craphics just don't look that awesome any longer.It does not mean that we gothic fans could not enjoy our beloved game or even UDC if it has interesting plot and gameplay to offer. It is just that press, new players usually look at the craphic-side first.Some of those will have patience to dig to the heart of the game, but some just turn away and do not bother to play on.
About your doom3 and hl2 cmments.those games belong to a whole different genre all together.Can't say much about doom3 as i have not played it, but half-life 2 was one of the best gaming experiences i've had in years..First half-life was even more remarkable experience for me.Not because of craphics, but because of gameplay.
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The focused mind can pierce through stone |
Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:09 pm |
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Uriziel
Grand Mage
Joined: 17 May 2002
Posts: 735
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I think some of you have bumped your head and need medical attention. Gothic's graphics are NOT intended to be photo-realistic...it is a grtty world where bad things happen. PB did it almost perfectly. Remember they are setting a "mood". I will concede that some of the player modelling could use work, but it is on par, or better than most games.....understanding what mood they are trying to evolk.
There have been ONLY 2 games I have played that offer such an immersive world.......Gothic 1, and Homeworld. I feel PB did a decent job with G2, but the "feel" was'nt the same...and frankly I thought the flora textures were lame.
Both Homeworld and Gothic were light years ahead of other games in "pulling you into the world"
BTW, if you have not played Homeworld, you do not have a single CLUE how diverse gameplay can be. In Gothic we find a new tidbit once in a while....in Homeworld new things are discovered everyday.....and the game came out in 1998.
Homeworld got away from their roots with the rest of the series(Cataclysm was a disaster and Homeworld2 became a micromanagement fest), Gothic stumbled a little bit with G2, but I think they know that. I only hope they can tell the publishers to STFU and let them do the game like it should be done.
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Chris: Dad, what's the blow-hole for?
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 12:18 am |
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Gorath
Mostly Harmless
Joined: 03 Sep 2001
Posts: 6327
Location: NRW, Germany |
The add-on is closer to Gothic. It feels much easier - as if all the pressure they had with G2 was gone.
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 12:25 am |
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ToddMcF2002
Leader of the Senate
Joined: 10 Jan 2005
Posts: 317
Location: Boston MA |
I think your missing what I'm saying - I know in close quarters that Gothic II is no match for Doom 3 / Half Life 2 - what I'm saying is that given the Draw Distances its more impressive. Half Life 2 and Doom 3 hem you in so they can do the killer poly counts. Given that G2 is so much older, I'm just not that impressed with D3 / Half Life 2 approximately 2 years later.
Anyway, the point is that the G2 technology, the engine, toolkit etc. are as good as anything released by any US studio. For its heyday, only Bethesda was competitive in my opinion. And Bethesda's Oblivion looks like it will trounce the Source engine pretty handidly.
Then there is G3...
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"For Innos!" |
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 1:43 pm |
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Chekote
Where’s my Banana?!?!
Joined: 08 Mar 2002
Posts: 1540
Location: Dont know, looks kind of green |
The draw distances in Gothic are nice, but to me thats not the most impressive aspect. Far Cry has far greater draw distances than Gothic.
To me the most amazing thing about Gothic's graphics is the geology of the landscape. I have never played a game that felt so beleivable in this respect.
Most developers of games seem to completely ignore the depth of the landscape. Its like they are still thinking in 2D or something. Take Morrowind for example, compared to gothic its a very flat world.
Gothic just takes the idea of depth to the extreme, with awe inspiring vista's, massive valeys, huge mountains and cliffs, Landbridges, incredible rock formations, cave's that just weave through every part of the world.
The fact that you can go over, under and through almost every part of the world, and the fact that its one huge world with (almost) no loading whatsover, is just incredible.
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IMHO my opinion is humble |
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:04 pm |
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ToddMcF2002
Leader of the Senate
Joined: 10 Jan 2005
Posts: 317
Location: Boston MA |
I agree entirely on the landscape issue. Extremely believable. I suppose Bethesda can be given some slack given the rediculous size of their world though.
As far as Morrowind -
I reached 3rd Level in Morrowind last night - its definately a great game, much better than my first impressions where I absolutely dispised it. Its gameplay very slow though - and the leveling system is a bit too complicated - I never know if I'm developing the right attributes. I'd hate to get to level 20 after 100 hours to find out my character is a POS. Anyway, fun so far but I really miss the Gothic gameplay.
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"For Innos!" |
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:27 pm |
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Dez
King of the Realms
Joined: 08 Jan 2003
Posts: 455
Location: Fortress of Tell Halaf |
Piranha bytes have allways had an eye for visuals.Landscape is one of the main strengths in gothic brand.Mw had better models allright, but the landscape let me down totally.Ok Vivec was a sight to see or the ghostgate,In gothic I&2 you could find that jaw-dropping quality everywhere.My favorite scenery in gothic2 must be the lake near onars or the waterfalls near malek.The dangerous forrest is something truly frightening.I sensed imidietly that this was a place not to be taken lightly, so i turned back.
This proves that piranhas know how to tell a story not only by books, and conversation, but through players eyes as we examine the gameworld.It just feels so lived, not that this place was created for us.From gothic 1 do you guys remember(ofcourse you do) the place on the road leading to the old mine.There was a skeleton(dead one), used fireplace, a potion, a pan, arrows. At the very first moment i began to think what had happened to that poor fellow, who was he, what he was doing there etc..
quote:
Originally posted by ToddMcF2002
I agree entirely on the landscape issue. Extremely believable. I suppose Bethesda can be given some slack given the rediculous size of their world though.
As far as Morrowind -
I reached 3rd Level in Morrowind last night - its definately a great game, much better than my first impressions where I absolutely dispised it. Its gameplay very slow though - and the leveling system is a bit too complicated - I never know if I'm developing the right attributes. I'd hate to get to level 20 after 100 hours to find out my character is a POS. Anyway, fun so far but I really miss the Gothic gameplay.
Morrowind was not my cup of tea.I just couldn't stand those lifeless npcs.Also mw's world lacked interactivity and it was far less multiple-layered in terms of what i experienced in gothics.for example If there are chairs why npcs won't sit on them? if a monster attacks while i'm escorting some traveler to a shrine, why doesnt the monster pay any atention to the traveler or counterclockwise.And that is only the glimpse of the iceberg.In gothic wolves attacked lambs, farmers attacked volves and so on.Smiths were hammering, people were sitting, standing, pissing, eating, drinking, training weapons,dancing, smoking some weed or pipe.List just goes on and on.In morrowind all the npcs just stand there waiting a player to come by.
But lets not make this thread mw vs gothic,  Thought mw was not really bad.It had lots of nice elements like lore(which i studied and read hours in vivec's library), character creation and the skills that got up by using them and the magic system, which was far more complex than ever in gothics.But at the end poor landscape, lifeless world, poor combat-system, cardboard npcs and lack of interactivity weighted more in the scale.IF benthesa are able to fix these on oblivion i'm going to become a fan-boy
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The focused mind can pierce through stone |
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 4:54 pm |
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ToddMcF2002
Leader of the Senate
Joined: 10 Jan 2005
Posts: 317
Location: Boston MA |
I'll bring up a different topic - Dungeon Lords.
One of the devs recently said somthing like this (not an exact quote, but the spirit of the thing):
"Yeah this game is coming along awesome - its just too cool to do a spinning karate move and dance through the Guillotine doors and fight the hordes in the swamp" etc. etc.
Karate? Guillotine doors? What exactly are they developing? Sounds like an all action game. I was hoping for a Gothic type game but this statement makes it sound more like Heretic 2 or Demon Stone. Action game with RPG Elements? God help us.
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"For Innos!" |
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:07 pm |
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Dez
King of the Realms
Joined: 08 Jan 2003
Posts: 455
Location: Fortress of Tell Halaf |
quote:
Originally posted by ToddMcF2002
I'll bring up a different topic - Dungeon Lords.
One of the devs recently said somthing like this (not an exact quote, but the spirit of the thing):
"Yeah this game is coming along awesome - its just too cool to do a spinning karate move and dance through the Guillotine doors and fight the hordes in the swamp" etc. etc.
Karate? Guillotine doors? What exactly are they developing? Sounds like an all action game. I was hoping for a Gothic type game but this statement makes it sound more like Heretic 2 or Demon Stone. Action game with RPG Elements? God help us.
Q: What is Dungeon Lords?
A: Dungeon Lords is a new breed of epic Fantasy RPG, a unique combination of RPG and Fighter game action in full 3D, featuring a deep storyline shrouded in mystery, surprise, and betrayal. Dungeon Lords is loaded with quests, personal missions, extensive skills and special abilities for customizing your own character hero from a variety of races and multiple class specializations, as you journey through an enchanted land of ancient castles, dark forests, and dungeon lairs braving an army of diabolical foes in real time action packed combat to uncover the secrets lying hidden within the depths of an evolving storyline. Dungeon Lords can be played either single-player stand alone, or in multi-player group sessions.
I don't think it is a bad thing that fighting is more like action than rpg. .I'll hope that it is like gothic where stats determine your strenght, fighting moves, but the actual outcome is in your own hands and skills .
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The focused mind can pierce through stone |
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:29 pm |
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elkston
High Emperor
Joined: 21 Sep 2002
Posts: 691
Location: North Carolina, USA |
quote:
Originally posted by Chekote
To me the most amazing thing about Gothic's graphics is the geology of the landscape. I have never played a game that felt so beleivable in this respect.
.
.
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Gothic just takes the idea of depth to the extreme, with awe inspiring vista's, massive valeys, huge mountains and cliffs, Landbridges, incredible rock formations, cave's that just weave through every part of the world.
The fact that you can go over, under and through almost every part of the world, and the fact that its one huge world with (almost) no loading whatsover, is just incredible.
Couldn't have said it better, my friend. The Gothic games are the best games out there if you love the feel of exploring and finding new things.
I hope that they can also keep loading zones down in G3 -- dividing the world into large seamless areas.
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All shall hear the words of Karras...the words of Karras |
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Fri Jan 14, 2005 7:19 pm |
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mazu
Protector of the Realm
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 251
Location: Desert Camp |
At first i saw an little review of G2 in PCZONE and i thought that it was just another regular RPG...
Then i got it and was so impressed that i got the 1st one too.
Now i think that they are the best games in the world!
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I really, really tried to figure out something clever here like "Life is a waterfall" and artistic stuff like that but no! I still cannot figure out a signature arrrr yarrr! Me bucko! Pirates! |
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Tue Jan 18, 2005 7:11 pm |
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